Real Estate Underground

Breaking Barriers for First-Time Buyers: Insights from Frank Rhodes, CEO of Ownify

• Ed Mathews • Season 4 • Episode 127

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Discover the future of homeownership with Frank Rode, CEO of Ownify, as we uncover innovative solutions for first-time homebuyers. Learn how Frank's unique equity-based approach is revolutionizing the traditional home buying model. With the support of investors, aspiring homeowners can gradually build equity in their homes, turning dreams into tangible reality. This episode promises insights into overcoming the down payment hurdle and offers a fresh perspective on real estate financing.

We also tackle the multifamily real estate market's complexities, from rising debt costs to supply-demand imbalances. Explore Ownify's strategic approach to mitigating these challenges by fostering an ownership mentality among tenants, ultimately reducing maintenance costs and enhancing investor returns. Frank shares the company's successful funding strategies and the importance of collaborating with friends, family, and interested parties to secure promising returns.

Looking ahead, we highlight Ownify's exciting expansion plans in the Raleigh-Durham area and beyond. Frank discusses how merging impact investing with attractive returns is key, utilizing proprietary technology and third-party data for robust underwriting and valuation. In addition, he offers valuable career advice and reflects on balancing family life with professional ambitions. Whether you're an aspiring homeowner or a potential investor, this episode is packed with insights and opportunities for impactful partnerships with Ownify.

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Ed Mathews:

Greetings and salutations. Real Estate Undergrounders. It is Ed Mathews with the Real Estate Underground. Thank you so much for listening. We're really excited about today's show. Turns out that the gentleman that we're going to be meeting is somebody who knows a whole bunch of people that I used to know. In fact, he lives in and works in my old stomping grounds in Silicon Valley Frank Rode. Welcome to the show. Ceo of Ownify, and I'm really excited to have this conversation. Welcome, Thank you, Ed, and excited to be here. Yeah, and so for those folks that don't know about Ownify, why don't you tell us a little bit?

Frank Rhodes:

about you and your company? Sure, so my background was really software, as you mentioned, silicon Valley. I ran a company called Nomis for 15 years, started it, grew it, venture-funded business and eventually sold it. And that company built the software that mortgage lenders use to price mortgages in North America, australia, new Zealand, uk, and so as part of that journey building that software, I got really deep into mortgage pricing and mortgage math, which is a fascinating topic for those of you who care.

Frank Rhodes:

One of the things I learned along the way and I saw in the data more and more more is that first-time buyers in the US, but really globally, are getting squeezed out of the market for a number of different reasons, and we kept seeing it in the data and I kept talking to the lenders about it and said what are you doing?

Frank Rhodes:

And mortgage lenders by and large sell very standardized products and those are government guarantee products by and large, so they don't have a whole lot of flexibility around restructuring, rethinking how to help first-time buyers. And, as I mentioned, I sold that company and about two years ago, with venture funding from the same VC that had originally funded Nomis, I started Onify, and Onify is really focused on helping first-time homebuyers in the US, overcome the down payment hurdle and so build an on-ramp for first-time buyers younger families who are looking to buy their first home, so starter homes generally and as part of that, we built an underwriting valuation fractionalization platform, as well as an investment fund that allows investors to come in and help solve this problem and, at the same time, generate returns. And I've had this journey, maybe somewhat similar to yours, ed, where I started in Silicon Valley, started in software and eventually ended up or not ended up, but are now in real estate and really real estate financing as the specialty that I focus on.

Ed Mathews:

At first blush. From an investor perspective, this looks like a debt fund play right A little bit and I'm curious. I want to get into the home ownership piece because that part I'm absolutely fascinated by and it's actually a passion of mine in terms of creating affordable housing, which is a real problem in the country. But from an investor perspective, can you walk us through how the fund works?

Frank Rhodes:

Yeah sure, at first blush you might think it's a debt fund or a debt vehicle, but really the way we changed the game here for first-time buyers is to rethink why you need debt in the first place and why traditionally abused debt and what Ownify has done is effectively said can we create an equity-based path to ownership for the first-time buyer? And so what Ownify does is it's not a debt fund, it's not a loan or a mortgage, it is actually an investment partnership around single-family homes. And here we partner the first-time buyer we call them the ONI on this journey to ownership with accredited investors. And so an investor who comes into the fund purchases equity in a home. Investor who comes into the fund purchases equity in a home. Now, we do use debt behind the scenes and as leverage for the fund, but the investor really purchases equity and makes an equity investment in single-family homes or, more accurately, in a diversified portfolio of single-family homes. And so the fund investors in the fund buy fractional interests in single-family homes, hold them over five years and progressively sell those fractional interests to the ONI, and that is the vehicle by which the customer builds equity in an unlevered fashion, and it's also the vehicle by which the investor generates capital gains through home price appreciation as well as passive income through rental income effectively.

Frank Rhodes:

So let me take a step back and explain how Ownify works. Basically, for a first-time buyer, what Ownify provides is the ability to pick a home. In general these are starter homes, so think $300,000, $400,000, maybe $500,000 at the margin. So think $300,000, $400,000, maybe $500,000 at the margin Pick a home. We make an all-cash offer on the home, purchase the home on behalf of the customer, and the customer on day one contributes 2% of the purchase price. So for that $400,000 home, that's $8,000 upfront. That's effectively the down payment. The customer enters into a contract with Ownify that provides for one a five-year occupancy agreement. So it's effectively a long-term lease that allows the customer to live in the home. The second component of the agreement is an equity purchase plan where the customer buys equity in the home every month for five years. And the way that math is dialed in is that, with the 2% as down payment plus the monthly payments, the customer builds 10% of the equity in the home over that five-year horizon. And then the third component of the agreement is a purchase option that allows the customer to purchase the home from the investor pool at any point during those five years at the then current market value.

Frank Rhodes:

Now why is that equity rather than debt? The reason it's equity is that each home is held by an LLC, a limited liability company. That LLC issues 10,000 shares we call them bricks, 10,000 bricks. And every month, as the customer builds their stack of bricks, so they start with 200. And in the first month they buy another roughly 13 bricks. Those bricks are traded or sold to the customer at the then current market value. And so let's say that $400,000 home a month after purchase is now worth $401,000. For argument's sake, right, a brick which was $40 on day one is now worth $40.10. So the customer buys bricks at that market value of $40.10.

Frank Rhodes:

And so over that five-year horizon, buying equity or buying bricks every month, what the customer is able to do is actually dollar cost average, the purchase of equity in the home.

Frank Rhodes:

Right, it's a fixed monthly payment, but they're buying variable number of bricks depending on the value of the home, and each home gets revalued once a month. And so for the customer that provides a bunch of interesting advantages. One they can't be underwater because they don't have a mortgage balance. They're building equity alongside the rental payment and we only charge rent on the portion of the home that they haven't bought. So the bigger the customer's stack of bricks right as they increase their equity, the fraction of the home that they have to pay rent on actually goes down, so the rental payment over that five-year horizon goes down. So that's the structure for the customer and the big benefit is it's an all-cash offer. We take care of property taxes, maintenance, repairs, insurance during those five years. So it provides certainty around the payment right. It provides the ability for a customer to pick a home that's for sale, not just a rental home, and it gives them the on-ramp effectively with these guardrails and a high degree of certainty of being able to buy the home.

Ed Mathews:

And so at the end of five years, if I'm doing the math right, the property's probably in an average scenario figure 4% appreciation. You're looking at 21, 22-ish percent value and wow, that's brilliant, no-transcript, and it totally undermines the whole. Renting is a better play than home ownership, right? Because Connecticut, for instance, I think the average home right now is about $379,000. Yeah, that $379,000 house. I think the math is they have to make, as a couple or individually, $126,000 a year and more than half of the population has no shot at home ownership in this close to that gap, yeah, and if you look at our customer base and the folks in the portfolio, they have great credit right.

Frank Rhodes:

So our average FICO credit score in the portfolio is 740. So these are folks who have good credit. They actually have decent incomes right around the area. Median income right the launch market in Raleigh-Durham that's somewhere around $90,000, $95,000. And so you look at their income and look at their credit, you say you should be able to afford a house.

Frank Rhodes:

The big hurdle that most folks have is the down payment right and now, more recently, also the monthly payment, as mortgage rates have reverted back to the long run average right. And so between house price appreciation, between student debt which basically everyone in our portfolio has, student debt which drags down their ability to save and afford a monthly payment house price appreciation, student debt, mortgage rates and then cash offers in the market, it's very hard for a first-time buyer to compete. And that's really the core solution that we've built right is allow those folks who are well-qualified to basically jump over the three, four, five years it would normally take them to save, get into a home now, start building equity right and then, once they're ready, they can buy it out the traditional way, if you will, with the mortgage.

Ed Mathews:

So I'm curious, with regard to the five-year time horizon, is there any flexibility on the back end of that in case, for instance, the economy happens to dip or we're still tank?

Frank Rhodes:

Yeah. So generally we tried to optimize for long enough to give the customer the runway to build up the equity without having I don't need all this debt. I don't want to own 100% of the home right, and technically you don't really own 100% until you've paid off the mortgage anyway. So what ends up happening at the end of five years is we just offer a renewal for another five years, right, you keep building equity and so theoretically you can purchase equity right Through this process over a long period of time. But you don't get the benefit of leverage as a customer. But you also don't get the downside of leverage and if you think about it, especially for first-time buyers who don't have a lot of assets, not having leverage can provide some real benefits too.

Ed Mathews:

Absolutely benefits too. Absolutely, yeah, if you're in the multifamily world where I live, the whole a lot of the risk in the market these days. His insurance is one, but their debt costs and leverage is a huge risk for a lot of folks in this market because with variable, with adjustable mortgage vehicles, it's become a little bit of a guessing game as to when the market's going to come back. The old axiom marry the building date, the rate, and there's a whole bunch of people out there wondering when do I get to turn this into long-term debt as opposed to the bridge debt, or we're still recovery debt to navigate the last couple of years? Right, and yesterday, obviously, the Fed didn't play along and they decided to keep the rates right where they're at and talk about additional inflation risk, which makes guys like me sweat a little bit. But yeah, so I hear you in terms of removing that risk.

Ed Mathews:

The other part of it is that, and one of the reasons, at least here in the Northeast and I suspect this is elsewhere, including your launch area in the Carolinas is the supply demand curve, right. The fact is that housing it's very difficult to develop right now. It has been difficult for a few years. You've got the 2008 financial crisis, which wiped out a huge chunk of general contractors and land developers, and they went off and went to law school or B school, or went and moved into technology or something else and never came back. And then, on top of that, you've got the variable mortgage or the rise in rates. There's a lot of risk out there.

Frank Rhodes:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's interesting, depending on what statistics and which economists you follow. We're short somewhere between two and a half to 4 million homes in the US, and depending on which city, which metro area you look at, that is worse in terms of the imbalance between supply and demand, and so that ultimately provides a real need, and we saw this, as I mentioned earlier, I saw it in the data of my prior company. Now we're leaning into this. What we're seeing on the consumer side is just this huge amount of demand, right, hundreds of people coming in every day. And because there's lots of demand, from an investor perspective we can be very selective, right, and today we're accepting less than 1% of applications into the program, which means that we can pick the folks who have the solid income, the good credit right, the ability to make sure that they ultimately meet their obligations throughout the program, and so what that translates into on the investor side is, across the portfolio, we've not had a single late payment. We've never had a day of vacancy, because we don't buy a home until we have a bona fide customer qualified, so they start paying their rental payment on day one, and because of the ownership mentality, this has been really interesting. Actually, it was part of the thesis and we've seen it now over the.

Frank Rhodes:

We've been at this for 18 months now with homes Actually in the portfolio. What we've seen over those 18 months is that the maintenance cost has been about 60% lower than SFR industry averages. Right, because the folks who live in these homes basically take care of them like they own them, which is the whole intent and the whole idea right around this. Yeah, and so we're doing little things like here's a video of how to drink your water heater, right, and show us a video of you drinking the water heater and we'll send you an extra brick or two and so we can use the equity, this concept of bricks in the home, to really incent that ownership behavior. To really incent that ownership behavior, and what that results in is ultimately higher yield for the investors in the fund. Right, because all of what normally is maintenance expense kind of gets reduced, increases the return back to the investor.

Ed Mathews:

Yeah, absolutely. And so how are you finding your investors? Because this is not necessarily, while I certainly think that there's venture capital money to be within your business model, clearly, but it's also a lot of real estate investor money and family office money. How are you getting the word out?

Frank Rhodes:

Yeah, so there are really two types of investors in Ownify right. There's the Ownify opcode, the operating company that is venture funded and that's where we built the technology, the AI, to do underwriting, fractionalization, all that. Then there is the Ownify Home Fund, and that is a traditional real estate fund in the sense of it invests in single family homes, albeit in this new structure that most folks hadn't seen before. And so for the investors in the fund, I think we've launched this and built it probably very similar to how most everyone else does it right, which is you tap your network of friends and family and all the folks that you know and say, look, here's an interesting opportunity. So we've gotten the first couple of million dollars through that network right, and those folks have seen nice returns. We then leaned into the local community. So, as you mentioned, we launched in the Carolinas, raleigh-durham the research triangle, and so we have local investors who like the idea of investing in their local community, enabling homeownership right, not having New York-based PE fund and buying up all the single-family homes, turning them into rentals right. So there's a kind of an impact and a double bottom line component. A number of investors respond to that and we just this week started broadening that a little bit more to more of a national footprint. To say, if folks are interested outside of Raleigh-Durham, outside of the North Carolina footprint, right, obviously we'd be happy to provide opportunities.

Frank Rhodes:

And so right now we've launched a $10 million fund. That is going pretty well. We're looking to have 40 to 50 homes in the fund by the end of this year in that launch market and then from there I think the playbook is really let's lift and shift that to the next couple of metros where we're activating local and regional capital market rate investors who like the idea of funding this. And, quite frankly, we're offering a 15% target IRR. So far we're a bit ahead of that. Again, it's early right. But when you look at the results so far, we're a bit ahead of that. Again, it's early right, but when you look at the results so far, we're tracking well against that, and so that's attractive because it isn't a below market impact investment that we normally think about solving a societal problem. But one of the things we're excited about is marrying impact with market rate returns and providing that to the investor.

Ed Mathews:

Yeah, and Ed Matthews comes along and he said okay, you're speaking my language. This is solving a clear problem within the community. A I'd love you to come to my community, but B the returns are something that I probably want to learn more about. How are you engaging with investors like me? Is there a webinar? Is there an offering memorandum? How does that work? Yep.

Frank Rhodes:

Yep, great question and thank you for the plug. So the offering memorandum and we just launched a webinar yesterday. Actually that is now live. You can watch a recording at onifycom or onifyfundcom forward slash webinar that walks you through exactly how the fund works, some of the stories, some of the early homes where we've bought the performance so far, and if you're an accredited investor and you're interested in that, you can go through that onboarding, learn everything there's a bunch of calculators et cetera and then also read, obviously, the private placement memorandum. And we use VeryVest as a partner to manage the fund itself. So that's where investor onboarding happens. But ownifyfundcom or ownifycom both of those get you to the webinar. And if you want to reach out to me directly obviously that's one of the things you watch the webinar. You're going to have a bunch of questions and so the call to action is schedule a meeting right, talk to me or any of my partners, my co-founder Ben, and we'll walk you through and answer any of the questions you might have.

Ed Mathews:

So, in the interest of the SEC not coming knocking on our door, I'm going to make one quick point, and that is we are not offering. This is not an offer of securities or disclosure of any interests. Under no circumstances Any material that we're talking about here should be considered an offer or a solicitation in any way, shape or form. The only way to get that is to hop on the Onifycom website, go through the webinar and meet the Onify team and we'll leave it at that. So that's funny. Our securities attorney, raj Mahali. When I first met him, he goes what are you looking for in terms of services for us? And I said A number one is keep me on the straight and narrow and don't allow me to do dumb stuff. That gets me in trouble. In terms of the operation itself, I'm curious have you built a lot of proprietary technology to manage your business, or is this more? Have you been able to acquire technology, other software enabling technologies to manage your business?

Frank Rhodes:

Yeah, it's a little bit of both. So we use a lot of third-party data sources in particular. I think what's unique, and where we've spent a lot of time with our tech team and our CTO, is building the underwriting and valuation engine. So we use something like 5,000 different data elements to underwrite the individual to make sure that they're qualified from a 5,000? Yes, so we actually go and we suck in all of the bank transactions out of someone's checking account. We build a full blown cashflow based model of their available income and their free cashflow and their ability to support a housing payment. We obviously look at their credit, we look at a bunch of other variables to make sure we fully understand a 360 degree of the customer and then we look and do the same thing for the home. So the way the process works and this is unique is that a customer comes to Onifycom, they go through the underwriting process and if they're qualified, we give them a budget and that says congratulations, ed, you're qualified for $100,000. Now we partner you with an agent. If you have your own agent, that's great, but we have partnered agents, realtors. You go out and you shop for homes and then you submit the home itself to another underwriting step.

Frank Rhodes:

Because obviously we want to make sure that we not just inspect and underwrite the home in terms of an investment asset, but also do so enter the deal and buy the home at the best price possible for our investors, right? Because ultimately, appreciation is a big driver of the returns in the fund and we want to make sure that we pick homes that will appreciate. And so we've built some really interesting forecast models to look at which homes, not just in a particular zip code, but down to the block level, what is the likelihood that homes are appreciating, based on the investment in the neighborhood, based on commercial activity, and so we build a forward-looking three to five-year forecast on what's the appreciation potential. Wow and please, yeah. And so, because it's a longer, it's a five-year-old period, right, and the investment term in the fund is five years. We haven't seen the outcome of that yet, given that we started 18 months ago, but so far we're ahead of the average appreciation in the markets that we're in, and it's based on AVMs and, again, we value each home every month, so we keep tabs on where's the strike price today, where's the value today, and so, between both the customer underwriting and the home underwriting and valuation.

Frank Rhodes:

It's a lot of third-party data, and then I think what's unique is the ability to then fractionalize those homes. And if you think about what does that mean? We have 10,000 bricks in each home, and bricks are owned either by the investor pool or by the only. They trade hands every month. At the core of Ownify is a big ledger that we're running that makes sure that we're tracking all of those transactions, the valuations and then the attribution of rental income, expenses etc along the way, and that is proprietary. That's not something that's out there, because most syndications or funds don't really invest at the brick level, right, you invest at the property level. So breaking that down it required some work on our side.

Ed Mathews:

Yeah, Because the other thing I was getting at is how the heck do you price a single family property, one in a neighborhood, on a monthly basis? That's a. From a data perspective, that's a Herculean effort.

Frank Rhodes:

So that's actually where third-party providers have helped us a lot. So that's actually where third-party providers have helped us a lot, right, and there are third-party providers and so we've set up API calls into three different independent AVM sources. And the interesting thing is, avms are they're basically backward looking. They look at all the transactions in the market, right, and they look at this is a three, two, et cetera. It looks like this and therefore we think today it's worth X, and whether X, whether that valuation, is 100% accurate, really doesn't matter all that much. We source from three different sources, so we work out where the outliers and, because we're only trading roughly 13, 14 bricks in any given month, if that valuation is a little high or a little low, wash this out, that five-year horizon.

Ed Mathews:

That dollar cost averaging you were talking about earlier.

Frank Rhodes:

Exactly right.

Ed Mathews:

Yeah, it's fascinating. Over the course you're not right today, but over the course of a five-year period, you're going to be right way more than you're wrong. So that's right, okay, all right, excellent. We are coming into the latter part of the conversation, so I'm going to switch from getting geeky on you and let's talk about you. So, in terms of, I'm always curious about why people get out of bed on Monday morning, right, and so I'm curious if you could finish this sentence for me.

Frank Rhodes:

My purpose is to provide a societal benefit, help people, helping people. And so what this boiled down to for me was and the software company that was doing well, but the core purpose of that company was to help mortgage lenders make more money, and that's not the core mission in life. So really, for me, it's about doing well by doing good right and seeing that those stories right. If you're helping a family, you're helping a single mother of three, which you just did right by the, by her first home. That's what gets me up in the morning yeah, it's, I couldn't agree more.

Frank Rhodes:

Contribution is the highest form of being I also have five-year-old twins, so they're really getting me up and working there's that right and and, but the fact is that your point is well taken.

Ed Mathews:

Chase manhattan is going to be okay exactly so. City group's going to be okay Exactly so. Citigroup is going to be just fine. So, in terms of your travels through corporate and your personal life, I'm always curious about the mentors and even the coaches that you've had and the advice that they've given, that you've put into action and implemented. What's the best advice you ever got and who gave it to you?

Frank Rhodes:

This is early on in my career. I worked for a consulting firm, and the partner at the time who was my boss for a couple of years, a guy named Neil Pomeroy. He had this extremely high degree of urgency and basically his point along the way was get started. What are you waiting for? Why are you still talking? Why aren't you doing this? And then, more recently, I came across this quote a couple of years ago which I really love. It is this quote of the best time to plant a tree is 20 years ago. The second best time is today. And so the basic notion, the basic piece of advice is just don't wait, get started. It's great to dream, it's great to plan, it's great to, but at the end of the day, what matters is getting started. And so Neil gave me that piece of advice, and that always stuck with me, and I think it's part of the drive that gets me up in the morning as well doesn't take in information on a regular basis.

Ed Mathews:

Leaders almost always tend to be readers in some way, shape or form, so I'm curious about how you sharpen that saw and take in information physical books, audio books, something else. And then I'm also curious about who you're paying attention to these days. Who's on your nightstand?

Frank Rhodes:

Yeah, I read, and I read physical books, I read on the Kindle. I had a rule that I started with when I was 16, 15, 16 to read a book a week, and I haven't broken it so far. Every now and then I have to cheat and find a really thin book. Linkus counts Exactly Something short Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde or something like that, and yeah, so reading is obviously probably the number one way in which I take in information.

Frank Rhodes:

I listen to podcasts right Running, working out, whatever, on planes commuting. Who am I paying attention to? I really I'm enjoying. I don't think he's very well known, but there's a guy named Kevin Erdman out there. He's a housing economist and he's got what I would say orthogonal thinking to the mainstream and I've really enjoyed his books. He has a newsletter out there, so I follow that. I really like the All In podcast. I think a lot of folks are listening to that right. Always fun, the banter and some of the insights that's coming out of that. And I'm reading a really interesting biography about Jimmy Carter right now, who is, as we're recording this, hanging on and maybe fading away, but I think there's a great book called His Very Best, which I highly recommend.

Ed Mathews:

If you could, as we're wrapping this up also tell me what success means to you.

Frank Rhodes:

I think it goes back to this doing well while doing good, right, having this double impact where you're doing well for yourself and for your family and your investors. So there's a monetary component and a success component, right, but there's also the are you creating a net positive in the world? That's really. My definition of success is looking at both of those.

Ed Mathews:

All right when not forging ahead with and making home ownership available to a whole swath of people that might not get that shot. What do you like to do for fun? How do you spend your time?

Frank Rhodes:

So I have the five-year-old twins, right, they keep me busy. What do you like to do for fun? How do you spend your time? So I have the five-year-old twins, right, they keep me busy. That's enough. I really. I enjoy biking mountain biking, road biking. I have an e-bike that I put them on, so we do a lot of adventures around the city and into the headlands out here in Marin, yeah, and just trying to stay in shape and juggling a lot of balls with a new company, relatively new company, relatively young kids, right, and reading, I think, the output book I'm reading right now there's a great new translation of the Odyssey out, which is such a phenomenal like you can take three pages and just read three pages and that's your zen for the day. So I do that for fun too.

Ed Mathews:

All right. Yeah, it's funny, you mentioned your twins again. I had a conversation with my uncle and I chose not to have kids way back in the day. And my uncle and I chose not to have kids way back in the day and when my kids were a little older than yours. They're now teenagers and one's in 21. But he asked me what do you do for fun, like hobbies, what do you do? And I'm like there's two little girls over there running around. That's it I do. Yeah, that's 90% of Saturdays and Sundays and afterwards. Hey, frank, I've really enjoyed this conversation. I've learned a lot and I appreciate your insights on the market and also congratulations on your successful launch of this company. It's really exciting and I am very much looking forward to watching this company grow. If people want to learn more about you or about Ownify or anything else that we talked about today, what's the best way to get in touch with you?

Frank Rhodes:

Email is always the easiest and fastest. Frank at ponifycom. O-w-n-i-f-y. Yeah, and I'm happy to hear from any of you and engage on whether that's investment or partnership or coming to your market, right? You mentioned definitely looking for the right partners as we roll this out.

Ed Mathews:

Absolutely, frank Rode, thank you so much for joining us today. I'm looking forward to seeing Ownify take off and as soon as I'm done hitting record, or when I hit the record button and turn it off, I'm going to pitch you on why you need to come to Connecticut because it's a great market.

Frank Rhodes:

Fantastic. Thank you, Ed.

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