Real Estate Underground

Empowering Teams and Communities through Home Ownership Opportunities, with Dale Wills

• Ed Mathews • Season 4 • Episode 133

Share episode

Send us a text

Unlock the secrets of successful real estate development and investment as we sit down with Dale Wills from Centra Companies. Discover how Dale transitioned from banking and construction to shaping entire communities like Saratoga Springs, Utah. Learn how Centra Companies thrived by transforming distressed properties post-2008 market crash into flourishing assets, partnering with banks to create win-win scenarios. Dale opens up about his strategic approach in various sectors, including land development for single-family homes, build-to-rent housing, and multifamily projects, sharing invaluable insights for both seasoned and aspiring developers.

Ever wondered how to make affordable housing work amidst skyrocketing costs? Dale breaks down innovative strategies for developing entry-level homes and townhomes, emphasizing the importance of targeting the right market segments. We explore the burgeoning Build-to-Rent market and delve into the legislative landscape affecting corporate ownership of residential properties. Dale's perspective on rental trends and housing strategies offers a fresh take on navigating challenging economic times while meeting the evolving needs of today's renters.

We also explore Centra Companies' groundbreaking employee benefit program, where team members can purchase homes at cost, fostering a culture of shared success. Dale discusses how this initiative, alongside operational efficiencies achieved through trade partnerships and automation, empowers his team and ensures project predictability. Beyond business, we touch on Dale's passions for outdoor activities and BYU sports, revealing the personal motivations that drive his professional accomplishments. Connect with Dale on LinkedIn to learn more about his work and insights at Centra Capital Partners.

Clark St Digital helps you grow your real estate company with:

  • Amazing Overseas Talent who cost 80% less than their US equivalents
  • Done-For-You subscription services
  • Done-For-You project services

Go to ClarkStDigital.com to schedule your free strategy meeting.

Additional Resources:

Find Us On Social Media:

Speaker 1:

Greetings and salutations. Real estate undergrounders. It is Ed Matthews with the Real Estate Underground. Thank you so much for joining us today. Today, selfishly, I'm really excited about this conversation we're about to have, because the gentleman that we're bringing in, dale Wills from Centra Companies, is a real estate developer and something that I'm particularly interested in because we just bought a whole bunch of land here at Clark Street Capital. So I'm going to be picking his brain and hopefully we'll drop a whole bunch of gold nuggets for the folks listening today. So, dale, welcome to the show and thank you for your time today. Thanks for having me. Yeah, absolutely so. For those that don't know your company and who you are and what you do, why don't you give us a little bit of background?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, we're all things real estate Primarily. We do for sale housing. We do some build for rent housing. We develop most of the land that we build on. Well, right now, because of the market conditions, we're not doing a lot of this, but we do value add with apartments or other commercial opportunities.

Speaker 1:

Okay, fantastic. So you got your hands in a whole bunch of different things. So, in terms of let's break these down, so multifamily build to rent and single family homes Yep, so let's start with the single family homes. Buying up land, you're entitling it, you are building single family homes and you are selling those homes.

Speaker 2:

That is correct. Yeah, sometimes we'll buy finished lots, but typically we're doing the entire process of all of the entitlements, the development, and then designing and building the homes.

Speaker 1:

Okay, and that, I believe, is your, is that's your primary business. That is correct. Yep, okay, so that's your wheelhouse, and so how'd you get into that business?

Speaker 2:

I've been throughout my entire life. I've been involved in the industry in some fashion. I worked in banking for a period of time doing construction development loans. I physically did construction for a few years in my younger age, then worked for a developer that created a city from scratch. That was a lot of fun. We had to build our own sewer plant, our own city water system, golf courses, everything.

Speaker 1:

Really In the States In the US.

Speaker 2:

That was in Utah Yep. Today that city probably has 60,000 population.

Speaker 1:

Wow, so what's the?

Speaker 2:

name of that town, Saratoga Springs.

Speaker 1:

Utah. No kidding, all right, we're going to talk about that story, but please continue, and then we'll get back to that.

Speaker 2:

And then from there, I had my own home building company and then went to work for a national home builder. And then the market fell apart and in 2010, decided to go back out on my own and work for myself. And then started Centra Companies and for the first, while we mostly were working with banks on distressed assets they had foreclosed on that they just didn't know what to do with. That was awesome and a lot of fun, but it ran its course in a matter of a couple of years.

Speaker 1:

Sure sure. In terms of taking over those distressed assets. Were you flipping, buying them, rehabbing them, selling them off? Or were you managing them on behalf of the banks? What was your role there?

Speaker 2:

We went to them and they had approached us and said hey, can you work with these assets? And I don't think this is going to be something you're going to be attracted to what we can pay you. And they said let's meet. So we sat down and for me it's always looking for how do you create that win, as Stephen Covey says it. And so we sat down. I said you've got lots as an example, but I can't pay you more than about 5,000 a piece. And through the discussions we said what if we partnered up on these?

Speaker 2:

So they ended up holding the asset and they were able to get a better return and we were able to take all of the profits. I don't know if you can call the bank getting a better return. Maybe minimize their loss might be the better word. And so they had product that was partially finished. They had some commercial, they had residential that got partially constructed and abandoned. The bank had to take back. They had developments that were partly developed, that we finished developing. So it was whatever the state was. They effectively said we'll sell you all these assets at this premium, but we'll provide you all of the funding and you don't have to carry any of it on your books, and so it worked out really well for all of us.

Speaker 1:

And they went in the end because they get a dead asset off their balance sheet right.

Speaker 2:

That was exactly it. The interesting thing is, as banks get audited frequently it's just a routine to protect the depositors and they get audited with a routine audit and the feds said, hey, wait a minute, these are performing assets, why are you still have them impaired? And they said we still own them. They said, yeah, but you've got a contract with Centra, you don't have to impair those anymore. And this particular bank it was millions of dollars went to their bottom line, back in to be able to lend, or got out on the street. And that's what really took off for us is we had lots of banks calling us in. Can you do the same thing with us?

Speaker 1:

Yes, and the answer was yes, sir, yes, ma'am, yes, we can.

Speaker 2:

Yes, it was, and it was so fun.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I'll bet, I'll bet. And then so that that kind of plays out over the 2010, 11, 12, 13, probably yeah, and the world's kind of starts to level set again and you get back into building or Towards the later part of that, there was a lender that had approached us that they had foreclosed on somebody.

Speaker 2:

They had lent a sizable amount of money. That company was in lending to builders and developers. So the builders and developers got foreclosed on. And then this lender got foreclosed on and the underlying lender called us and said you're interested in buying these assets. And it was interesting because there was 450 properties in this portfolio. Goodness, some of them was just a single lot. Others there was one that was a single piece of property that we ended up developing into 120 townhomes, and so it was all over the board.

Speaker 2:

And they said yeah, if you want to buy it, you can pay cash and close quickly. Let's do the deal. And so we had to underwrite it very quickly and some of the assets we just didn't have time to go look at. And so we said we're just going to give it a zero basis and if it's not worth anything we'll just walk away on tax forfeiture. If it's worth something, that's a bonus. So we underwrote it and we closed in a fairly short period of time, and with that's where we really then was the new phase, cause at that point we'd worked through most of the bank assets, but we had outright bought those assets.

Speaker 1:

Okay, so let's talk about your capital. Stack on those, stack on a deal like that. What did that look like?

Speaker 2:

We ended up bringing in an equity partner on that. We got some bank debt and then an equity partner plus some of our own equity, and that equity partner was a partner throughout the entire 450 properties. Some of those properties we actually just sold. Some of the last ones two, three years ago. Oh wow, it went for quite a while because I believe we closed on those I think it was 2013 is when we purchased it and so the equity partner participated in everything. We had a project that we developed into 80 lots and built and sold 80 houses, so that equity partner was able to participate in the sale of those units and sharing that profit with us, and so we did that throughout the entire portfolio.

Speaker 1:

Okay and then. So I've heard you say townhomes and you've said houses. So what kind of houses are you talking about? Are you talking about starter homes? Are you talking about next-gen, next-level homes, or are you talking about McMansions and luxury homes?

Speaker 2:

No, most of our product it's either empty nester meaning I'm tired of the stairs, my kids have moved out product. It's either empty nester meaning I'm tired of the stairs, my kids have moved out, so it's all single level we do quite a bit of that or first time buyers or just one move up, so it's mostly affordable product. Our belief is the old funnel theory At the top there's a lot of people that can afford $300,000. And then there's less at four and less at five, and so there's really great custom builders and McMansion builders. That's just not us. We're very much about efficiencies and giving the best value we can.

Speaker 1:

And so that's the business you continue to operate today.

Speaker 2:

That is correct, yeah, and so part of that is townhomes. A lot of our townhomes are first-time buyers, single mothers that are hitting those townhomes, and then detached homes as well.

Speaker 1:

Fantastic. Yeah, affordable housing is something I'm passionate about as well, and so I'm curious in terms of if you pay attention to social media, a lot of people out there are saying that development is dead because of the cost of materials, the cost of labor, and so how are you weathering that storm?

Speaker 2:

I'm a big believer in you'll find whatever you're looking for, and there's opportunities in every market. When everybody was dying in 2010 and 11, we said, hey, let's go work with banks, let's help them work through their assets. And today it really is about entry level. Interest rates are really high, materials are really high, but there's still a need for housing. People still want to own homes and, with the interest rates being so high, there's so many people that are locked into their home. I've got a two and a half to three and a half percent interest rate.

Speaker 2:

Well, to get a bigger house and go get a 7% interest rate just most people can't do it, and so people that want to buy a house. In many cases, their options are limited and new homes are the primary way that they're going to buy a house. And so for us, if you're focused on that entry level first time buyer, there's a lot of opportunity right now. We build everything. We build on speculation, meaning we're going to build it and hope a buyer shows up. We don't release them for sale until we hit frame stage. In the last six months, we've had one house got finished before it had a buyer.

Speaker 1:

Just out of curiosity.

Speaker 2:

In the last six months, probably about 100 units.

Speaker 1:

Wow. So 99% of your units are sold somewhere between frame and finish.

Speaker 2:

That's right. Yeah, yeah, so we don't see a problem in the market. We love it. Yeah, yeah, so it's. We don't see a problem in the market.

Speaker 1:

We love it, yeah, and so when you're now, you're in Minneapolis area, correct? That's correct, yep. And what markets are you building in these days?

Speaker 2:

Right now we're just focused on the Minneapolis market, the suburbs of Minneapolis. We're not in Minneapolis itself, but all the suburbs surrounding Minneapolis-St Paul.

Speaker 1:

Okay, All right and fascinating, and so when you you also mentioned Build2Rent and I've got a good friend of mine, tony Torres, who has done and his partners have done quite well in the Tennessee markets I'm curious about your experience with BTR and how you got into that and what you're seeing in the marketplace.

Speaker 2:

For us, it just became a natural function. We're already building houses. It's pretty easy to say if this makes sense, let's keep them and rent them. We do own some apartments and we own, build for rent homes, and it just became a natural transition of some of the product that we had. What's an interesting note about this is what we see is there's a lot of push there was some legislation in Congress to outlaw corporations from owning houses, and what's interesting is we're seeing those our apartments. For the most part this is not a blanket statement, but for the most part, anybody in our apartments want to own a home. That's their eventual goal. I'm going to save up the money. I'm going to eventually buy a house.

Speaker 2:

Most of the people renting houses don't want to own. There's a reason they're renting they still want the yard for the dog, they still want the yard for the kids, they still want to have their own space, they want a larger garage, whatever the component is, and there's a reason they didn't buy. There's a reason they're renting. What are the family circumstances, employment circumstances, and so we find that pretty interesting. As people talk about legislating, this is people that are renting houses want to. I just don't. I don't want to hassle with owning the house or I'm only here for a couple of years. We also find people that are renting houses stay longer.

Speaker 1:

Without a doubt, right. What's your experience in terms of resident retention?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, be mindful, Our apartments are very much affordable workforce housing. We don't do high end apartments at all and so the demographic is different when you consider that. But our apartments it's about a year and a half, is our turnover Okay, and the houses it's three years.

Speaker 1:

That's pretty good Okay.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so they stay longer, which is also minimize your risk. Your expensive part is the turnover.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, without a doubt. Yeah, we operate with the same philosophy that resident retention is a huge metric that we pay attention to because with every year that passes that a resident is happy and proud where they live. There's no lease up, there's no turnover, and all that costs money.

Speaker 2:

And you make another good point there. On the houses, we also find there's a little more. They act as though they own it, which we love Absolutely. The apartments are a little more transitional, whereas the house they're investing time to make sure that yard stays looking nice and that there's some ownership, pride of ownership, albeit it's still being a rental.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, now with the built to rent. I'm curious do you folks focus predominantly on single family homes or do you also have duplexes and other formats in the portfolio?

Speaker 2:

Duplexes aren't very common in the Minneapolis market. We've actually experimented with them and not had a lot of luck, and so everybody else was smarter. We're the ones that had to experiment and figure it out. Townhomes that have four to eight units in a row are really fairly common, and then the detached single families, and so we do a little bit of both of the townhomes row townhomes as well as the detached Gotcha, Gotcha and then obviously getting into apartment buildings and multifamily natural progression of your business.

Speaker 1:

Was that more? Was that also development projects or was that more opportunistic property or set of properties came on the market and you decided to. Everything we've done so far on apartments have been value add opportunities okay, so you're buying beat up apartment buildings that are that need some love and you're going in and working your magic and yeah yeah, there's some real, really great opportunities.

Speaker 2:

through federal and state grants they can help subsidize those with. The idea is, what they don't want is you go and really rehab them and double the rents. Now that workforce doesn't have a place to go and you've displaced them all. And so there's some real opportunities to be able to get some of that money to be able to help subsidize that, bring it back up to a living standard. We had one that the decks were falling off the building, the corner of the foundation was failing, things like really shouldn't be occupied.

Speaker 1:

So tell me more about these programs. I'm curious. So is it through HUD, or is it through USDA or something Someone else?

Speaker 2:

It depends on the location. Usda has some really great programs. That's usually more in your rural place locations. Hud has financing that they can give you. That subsidizes but a lower cost. In Minnesota there's through the state housing authority there's some opportunities to be able to get grants if you're willing to keep the rents down. Depending on how the state regulates it, there's housing tax credits, so the federal government issues tax credits, every state gets them and then each state chooses how they're going to distribute them. Many of the states will use some of those tax credits to say, okay, take this complex, bring it to living standard, we will then subsidize that. But in turn you have to keep the rents at an affordable level.

Speaker 1:

Right, right. So then you're looking at. So when you say affordable, you're looking at HUD's fair market rates or something else.

Speaker 2:

It's usually a percentage of the adjusted gross income of that area. Okay, and so the more money they give you, the lower you have to be of that adjusted income. However, when you look at it, you can go to a market and especially when you're doing workforce housing, when the rents are a thousand bucks, $1,200 a month, it's a lot easier to do. You say, okay, what's the adjusted? And if it's 60% of the adjusted gross income of the area, 60%, not very many people are living in C grade apartments that are making more than that. Anyway. You're really not disqualifying many people, but you're doing a pretty great service because you're improving the area.

Speaker 2:

And we had two apartment complexes we bought that it was the number one and the number two worst crime apartments in the city and we were. We went in, we cleaned them up, we got rid of the crime. The people that were living there now have a clean place that they can call home. That's safe. Living there now have a clean place that that they can call home that's safe, and the city was really thrilled with it because we helped solve several problems.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, you get rid of the knuckleheads and then the, and then the police department doesn't have to spend their, their assets and their time, yes, in the parking lot. And then the people are are okay and feel safe to go out to their car or go check the mail, and that's a good thing. You're doing a good way around right kids to go out to their car or go check the mail, and that's a good thing. You're doing a good job around right. Kids can go out and play all of that right.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah it was. They were rough. It took us a while to get there.

Speaker 1:

So what's the process that you had to go through to to clean that up?

Speaker 2:

A lot of them, the troublemakers. We just said, hey, we'll let you out of your lease. We just said, hey, we'll let you out of your lease, we'll give you a month's free rent, we'll give you your security deposit. We don't care what the condition is. So they're looking at it going okay, I get my security deposit back, plus I get a month's free rent. Most of them were like that's a gold mine, I'll take it and left. There's a few of them, unfortunately.

Speaker 2:

One story is we had a gal that we had to evict her and so we went to court. We're in court and said hey, she's got people living there that shouldn't be. She's dealing drugs in her apartment. We listed all these things and she said no, and she's crying to the judge. I don't do drugs, I don't have anybody living here that shouldn't be. And ultimately judge said all right, you got to leave.

Speaker 2:

While I was in court, I get a message on my phone from the local PD. We get out of court and I call him and said hey, what's up? He said hey, just wanted you to be aware. We went to your apartments because we knew if somebody was in your apartments it had a felony. We went to arrest him. We knocked on the door. They saw us Try slamming on us. We put our boot in, we pulled him out, we cuff him, we arrest him. His girlfriend comes out and says oh, can I give him a hug before he leaves? And they said sure, she reaches into his pocket, pulls out some meth to try and slide it into her pocket. They see it, they arrest her. Oops, said so, we just want you to be aware.

Speaker 1:

I said what unit number and they tell me it was the unit that the lady we had just been to court for that said I don't do drugs and I don't have anybody living in my apartment. Oh my goodness.

Speaker 2:

So that that helped. I'll bet yeah. Yeah, there's a lot of stories that just make us chuckle when we remember them.

Speaker 1:

Your Honor, you're never going to believe what just happened this morning, right, exactly Fantastic, fantastic. So, in terms of where you're taking the business, obviously single family development is your focus, roughly. What does the rest of 2024 look like? What does 2025 look like for you?

Speaker 2:

We just started. A few months ago, we started Central Capital Partners and that's giving people the ability to co-invest with us and build wealth. Interestingly enough, it started about two years ago. We give an opportunity for all of our employees can buy houses at cost Wow, and so we have some that really take advantage of it and they're building up a rental portfolio.

Speaker 2:

And two years ago I'm talking to one of our guys that has taken advantage of this many times.

Speaker 2:

He's got many homes in his portfolio and we were comparing tax advantages and I was just like this is a travesty that I can build wealth significantly faster than you can because of our tax status, because you're W-2 and I'm self-employed, right, and that really bothered me. It's like how do I help them accelerate their wealth? Building started to where, ultimately, today, we now have central capital partners, but our employees, all the public, can do it as well, but our employees can now invest bonuses into projects that we have. Our employees can invest their IRAs into projects that we have and giving them some of the same tax advantages that I personally have. And while we did that, we said let's just open that up to anybody that wants to co-invest and build wealth with us. So we're really excited about that because that's going to open up some doors and do some other things where we're looking at doing some build for rent communities in other locations outside of Minneapolis there's some markets that we're pretty excited about, and so that's really where the next phase is for us.

Speaker 1:

Excellent, excellent. That's amazing that you do that for your employees. Excellent, excellent. That's amazing that you do that for your employees. So when it and obviously when an employee buys a property at cost, that's immediately. They're immediately getting equity, which is amazing, and they get the depreciation so that they can wash that against their income, which lowers their April 15th tax bill, which is also extremely generous of you. Why do that? Why not just keep it for yourself? Yeah, I think I know why and I totally buy in, but I'm curious what your thinking is.

Speaker 2:

Our motto is we improve everything we touch, and so, whether that's an old building that's run down, whether it's making people we work with their very best selves, or whether it's helping you build wealth and income, I'm wealthy by myself. That's not very fun, right. I need to have friends that are doing well too.

Speaker 1:

Sure, sure. And it also helps with the company mission. Right yeah, he's rolling the same way and everybody's bought in to the same mission. All it does is help you serve your customers and and grow the business, so everybody wins. Rising tide.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, the guy that takes advantage of it the most. He's my longest friend in Minnesota. I've been living here now for 18 years and he's the first person I met here and he's been working with me the entire 18 years and he's the one that that actually prompted this entire process.

Speaker 1:

Excellent, that's great. Hopefully they that that person. They buy him coffee on a very regular basis and perhaps even Friday afternoons buy him lunch to thank him for prompting this program that you've put in place for your employees.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah, he's awesome. We love him. We've got a lot of really great people on our team.

Speaker 1:

I'll bet. So what does your team look like? How big is it? How are you organized?

Speaker 2:

We run pretty lean W2 employees I think we're right around 18 to 20 right now so we contract out most everything we can, so even the construction we don't. We like to tell our guys if you're lifting anything other than a pencil, we paid somebody twice to do that job, and so we contract it all. We even contract for a lot of the entitlements the engineering, the development, the construction. Our sales are contracted out. We use real estate brokers and agents to sell for us. We try to stay really lean, which makes it easier to weather hard times, and then we can take care of it because we do a profit sharing program with our team as well, and so it gives them a greater opportunity to build wealth.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, fantastic. And so you and your company are not general contractors per se. You hire general contractors.

Speaker 2:

We are a general contractor, but we're hiring out every aspect of it, so we do have a team that bids it all out and manages the construction. But really, when you build the same thing over and you got the same trades, you know there's not a lot of supervision. We've got some really good trade partners and we do a lot of automation. This is when you're supposed to show up. This is what you're putting in, this is when you're supposed to be done, and we've got really good trade partners that they just know. This is the day I'm going to show up, this is what I'm going to frame, this is the day I've got to be done, and they just don't need a lot of babysitting, which is, which is phenomenal.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 1:

And what allows you to control your costs. So basically you, we're going to use A, B and C footprints in this pattern Go.

Speaker 2:

And that's exactly right. Yeah, we do not offer any options. Um, it's, you can pick which house you want and we'll tell you which lot it's on. But exactly what you said, our projects have anywhere from one floor plan to three floor plans available, and closer to one is better than three. Yes, and it's the same thing over and over. We go in just like you said and we predetermine this house is going on this lot, this house is going on this lot and we build them in order. So if somebody says I want this lot, that's 20 down, it's like, okay, you got to wait until we build the other 19 first.

Speaker 1:

Right, and and and okay, so, logistically, if you're building two different plans in a neighborhood, do you build and let's say, one's a Cape and one's a one's a ranch right? Do you build all the ranches first and then all the Capes, or do you do them? You know, assuming that you're alternating ranch Cape, ranch Cape.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, we'll do it. We'll do it intermittently A lot of times. Let's say, we have two products One might be 60% of what we sell and the other one might be 40% and so we'll go in and lay it out and say, okay, we're going to have two of this one and then one of that one, and then, just to break it up, we might go then one and one and then three and two, and we do different elevations, meaning the fronts of the house will slightly alter with roof lines or different things to give it some character. We change color palettes on the exterior, just so. There is some although we have done projects where we do one house and they're all the same color and very uniform. So we're just a very built, boring builder and our goal is to create great value for our investors, great value to our trade partners and great value to who's buying.

Speaker 1:

But I'll tell you, dale, boring's good, boring's fun, and boring is profitable for everybody, right, for your clients, for you, for your contractors, because everybody's more efficient. Right, if you don't have to think through and read plans and get down to the specific details of okay, we're going to move this wall over here and move this plumbing over there and the wet wall.

Speaker 2:

Well, even the simple stuff. It applies to the simple stuff, the carpet layers. No, if it's a central property, it's the same carpet, right? We're putting it everywhere. There is no change, and so they can buy it in bulk. They don't have to check, they don't have to worry about did I put the right carpet in today and I have to tear it out. It makes it very efficient for all of the trades.

Speaker 1:

And I assume you do the same thing with your rental property. Same paint everywhere, same cabin. Yes, do the exact same thing. So for those listening out there, commonality and boring is something that's going to make it so much easier to manage your properties, because you don't have to. Your people don't have to ask questions. They know exactly which countertops go in, which sinks go in, which lighting fixtures go in, which carpet goes in to the any particular unit, and it makes life a whole lot easier.

Speaker 2:

You make a really good point there. In addition to that very well is not only did we keep it simple when we built, but when you have turnover right, Every unit's got the same paint right. Every unit has the exact same faucet, so I could keep a handful of items that are routine repair and we don't have to worry about running to Home Depot to get that part, because we just have the spare part. When I have to paint, we don't have to guess which color, because every unit's the exact same color.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, absolutely yeah, we do the exact same thing, and it does make life a whole lot easier, and my phone doesn't ring for that exact reason. Hey, what color are we painting this? Yeah, air, wind, breath, it's the same. It's the exact same place.

Speaker 2:

I would caution people that are listening that you might be tempted, or people on your team might be tempted to say, oh, but that's so boring. You go visit your neighbor and it looks the same. They decorate different, they have a different couch, they have a different picture. I've never had a buyer complain about it. I only have team members. It'll be like oh, but we've got to be a little more unique.

Speaker 1:

And here's the thing In every house that I've sold when I've visited if I visited in the future the folks move in and they make it their own anyway. Right, they change the paint scheme, they decorate, they do. They make it their own anyway, and that's fine. All you're doing is creating a simple palette for them to move in and then make it their own. That's all you're doing.

Speaker 2:

Yes, yes, I agree.

Speaker 1:

All right, hey Dale, I could talk for days about this stuff. I'm absolutely fascinated by how well run your businesses, so congratulations on that. But it's time to get to the final four, because we're going to end up talking for hours and we're going to put people to sleep. Two real estate geeks talking about-.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, it's fun for us. I'm not sure about Lowe's listening.

Speaker 1:

I'm thrilled. So the final four. One thing I'm always curious about is what gets you out of bed on Monday mornings. Please finish this sentence for me. My purpose is.

Speaker 2:

To improve everything we touch. That's our focus.

Speaker 1:

It's a great mission. I love that. Second thing I always I usually find that leaders of companies and leaders of people tend to be avid readers as well, and so I'm curious how you take in information, whether that's physical books or audio books or podcasts or something, and then also who you're paying attention to these days.

Speaker 2:

I do read a lot and when I say read, I use that term loosely. I'm about 30% physically reading a book and about 70% listening to a book. But I do 50 to 60 books a year and there's so much to read that it's hard to say what is your favorite book, because what's speaking to me today. But recently I've really enjoyed Ben Hardy's books based on Dan Sullivan's teachings. 10x is easier than 2X. Who Not how? Gap and the Gain those have really spoke to me in the last year pretty strong.

Speaker 1:

I haven't read Gap and the Gain, but I'm going to put that on the list and, by the way, as always, we'll put these in the show notes so that you folks can go find them.

Speaker 2:

Anybody that has it. I would recommend do gap in the gain. First who, not how? Second, 10x is easier than 2X because they build upon each other.

Speaker 1:

All right, fantastic, I'm actually going to do it backwards, because I've already read that.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, oh, if it's backwards, it's still just as great. It's a gem either way.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, absolutely. And so the third question I'm always curious about mentors and who's given you guidance along the way, and so what's the best advice you've ever gotten and who gave it to you?

Speaker 2:

I've got a friend, keith Cunningham. He's actually written a book, the Road Less Stupid. I love that book. It looks like you've enjoyed it as well. Keith would teach me a principle over and over, and the principle was when you're looking at real estate, keith made hundreds of millions in real estate and lost all of it in the late 90s. And he said go through a process of what's the worst thing can happen, what's the best thing that can happen, and if you can't see the worst and the best, don't do the deal, because you're missing something, because there's always a worst case. And then you ask yourself can you live with the worst case scenario? And if the answer is no, pass on the deal. If the answer is yes, then go do the deal. And we use that on every deal we buy.

Speaker 1:

It's excellent advice and, by the way, if you're out there and you don't know who Keith Cunningham is, you need to go find. I discovered Keith through Tony Robbins, as a matter of fact, through business mastery and that whole curriculum, and I have become a huge fan of Keith's teachings.

Speaker 2:

And Keith still does does guest lecture for Tony at the at those business mastery events still.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I'm only going back probably a couple of years that I came across Keith. Yeah, indeed, all right. Last question of the final four. Finish this sentence. For me, success means what?

Speaker 2:

For me, it really is the same as the first one. Am I improving those that I'm involved with, the things that I'm involved in? I'm all about constantly improving myself, the people that I'm involved with, the things that I'm involved in. I'm all about constantly improving myself, the people that I'm working with and the projects we're involved in. That's really the most important thing to me is are we making a difference?

Speaker 1:

Fantastic. Clearly you are Dale when not talking about real estate. How do you like to spend your time? What do you like to?

Speaker 2:

do. Actually, you could see, if anybody's watching on video, the cattle over my shoulders. We took those pictures. We got a cattle ranch. I actually live on the ranch. Just before we started this video I was out helping lay out some corral fencing, and so we love, we love the cattle, we love water skiing, snow skiing. We love the cattle, we love water skiing, snow skiing. We love college football, basketball. If it's outside, we're there, let's go, let's have fun.

Speaker 1:

So college football, college basketball who are you following? Minnesota or somebody else?

Speaker 2:

It's interesting enough, I'm in Minnesota, but we're big BYU fans. Okay, all right, we love the BYU brand, we love the Big 12 that they've invited us to and just having a lot of fun.

Speaker 1:

Awesome, Awesome and Dale. So if folks want to get in touch with you or learn more about you or Centra companies, what's the best way to get in touch?

Speaker 2:

Two ways. I'm on LinkedIn, pretty active on LinkedIn under Dale Wills on LinkedIn, and then centracapitalpartnerscom is a great place to see things that we've got going on and opportunities that we have.

Speaker 1:

Fantastic. Dale Wills, thank you so much. It's a pleasure to meet you and I really enjoyed our conversation. Like I said, I could talk for days with you about this stuff. So congratulations on your success, continued good fortune and once again, thank you.

Speaker 2:

Thanks for having me, Ed.

People on this episode

Head Shot

Ed Mathews - Clark St Capital

Host