Real Estate Underground

From The NFL to Wall Street to Main Street: Steve Schull's Playbook for Broker Success

• Ed Mathews • Season 4 • Episode 138

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Join Ed Mathews on this episode of Real Estate Underground for an exclusive interview with Steve Schull, a renowned performance coach. Steve shares his inspiring journey from playing in the NFL to becoming a top Wall Street professional and ultimately a premier real estate coach. 

With over 32 years of experience and 60,000 hours of one-on-one coaching, Steve divulges his six core building blocks for a sustainable and successful real estate career. 

Learn about his unique approach to mindfulness, time optimization, relationship cultivation, setting standards, mastering communication, and strategic action. 

This episode is packed with invaluable insights and advice for real estate professionals and anyone looking to excel in their field.

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Speaker 1:

Greetings and salutations. Real Estate Undergrounders. It is Ed Matthews with the Real Estate Underground. Thank you so much for joining us today. Today is a special episode of the Real Estate Underground. I am here with Steve Schull, who is a performance coach and someone that I know several, many of you out in the field know especially you, real estate agents and real estate brokers. Steve, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for joining us.

Speaker 2:

Thank you for having me.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, it's a pleasure and honor. So for those of us who don't know your background and your business, why don't you tell us a little bit about who you are and what you do for a living?

Speaker 2:

Okay Again. My name is Steve Scholl. My company is Performance Coaching. Grew up in Bucks County, Pennsylvania, outside of Philadelphia. I went to the College of William Mary on a football scholarship. From there made it with the Miami Dolphins as a free agent. I was not drafted, Played four years in the NFL. Played in Super Bowl XVII against the Washington Redskins. Unfortunately, we lost that day. However, I was one of the tri-captains for the game, which was the highlight of anyone's career. A knee injury ended my career after four years, Went back and got my MBA at the University of Miami, spent five years on Wall Street, worked with Salomon Brothers on their fixed income institutional desk and then made a drastic shift, moved from the East Coast to the West Coast and got into residential real estate.

Speaker 2:

And that was in 1991. And in my first year in residential real estate with a partner closed 53 properties. In my second year I was on track to sell a hundred homes when I came up with the idea of creating a real estate coaching program and went to the real estate trainer whose programs I'd been attending, Mike Ferry, with the idea of creating real estate coaching. It did not exist at the time. There were real estate trainers and they had workshops and seminars and events, but coaching did not exist, and we launched the first coaching program in 1990.

Speaker 2:

I stayed with Mike through 1996 when I opened my own company, Performance Coaching. I've been doing that ever since. In 2007, with two other partners, opened a real estate brokerage here in Southern California called Telus Properties that eventually sold to Douglas Elliman. I've always maintained my coaching practice throughout, and so here I am, headed into 2025, my 32nd year as a real estate coach and my business is. All my clients are residential real estate professionals. Many of them are the top agents in the industry, and that's what I do every day Awesome.

Speaker 1:

Congratulations on your career thus far. Let's talk about the practice and what drew you to this business. Obviously, working for Wall Street and then selling Main Street two very different vocations, maybe similar energy, but very different in terms of career path. What drew you to real estate? What?

Speaker 2:

drew you to real estate. Oh, it was interesting. I was listening to a CD. I'm not sure why I was listening to the CD, but it was actually Mike Ferry interviewing two agents in Long Beach, california, kim and Daryl Rouse, and they were in their second year and they were on track to sell a hundred homes. And I listened to this interview and it just made sense to me. Real estate, selling real estate, was a progression Contacts, equal leads, leads, equal appointments, equal listings, equal sales and that made sense. And I had met someone who was a residential real estate agent and decided I was going to go in that direction. And that's the direction I went in and, as I mentioned, we got off to a very fast start.

Speaker 2:

I didn't actually enjoy selling real estate. However, I got it. I was knocking on 200 doors a day. I was calling every expired listing every day. I did it by the book in terms of if you're going to sit down and do this business and do it in a very disciplined way. But I took all that from my sports background. The advantage of you learn what practice is all about. You learn what's showing up every day, being consistent, working on your skills. So I was fortunate that everything that I learned for my 11 years of playing football. I just took that into my real estate practice and it worked.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, it's interesting. So I am a recovering W2 technology guy and when I was hiring people, the two types of people that always popped up at the top of my hiring lists were ex-military and ex-athletes, and for exactly the reason you said is they know that showing up and being consistent is basically the only thing, that it's one of the major things that separates the winners from the folks that struggle.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and I was very fortunate. My coach with the Miami Dolphins was Don Shula was very fortunate. My coach with the Miami Dolphins was Don Shula, the winningest coach in NFL history. And he was the winningest coach and still is for a reason. He demanded perfection 100% of the time, and when you're in an environment like that, it really brings out the best in you and pushes you well beyond any limits you place on yourself.

Speaker 1:

One of the things that I'm always paying attention to is and we're going to talk about books later on in terms of what you pay attention to but I know that you're the author of three different books and one of them that was interesting. The title jumped out at me was Real Estate is Not Rocket Science, right? And you talk about the six things that you need to drive a sustainable real estate is not rocket science, right? And you talk about the six things that you need to drive a sustainable real estate business. Can we talk about that a little bit?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, absolutely, and I love the title of the book. It's something I've said for a really long time, excuse me, and I titled the book that way because, guess what? Real estate is not rocket science. As I said, what I got initially was that progression, contacts, equal leads. Leads equal appointments, equal listings, equal sales. I've expanded upon that over the 32 years. However, that's still the core progression of real estate. And the deals are complicated Doing a deal with someone helping them buy and sell a home that can be complicated. However, the business is not complicated.

Speaker 2:

Years of doing this, I can confidently say I have coached more real estate professionals one-on-one than any other human being on planet earth. I've logged in over 60,000 hours of one-on-one coaching and what I've learned in doing that? I boiled it down to six core building blocks. One is practicing mindfulness. You've got to get your head on straight. If you don't have your head on straight, nothing else matters. That's the foundational piece, and we'll get into books in a little bit.

Speaker 2:

What really got my attention that was probably seven years ago or so was a book called the Untethered Soul by Michael Singer, and that caused a major shift from the perspective. I had always grown up in the environment of setting goals and having a plan and if you work hard enough, you can make things happen. In reading Michael Singer, I really got it. That's all nonsense. The universe is going to do what the universe is going to do, right, and we don't control what happens in life. What we control is how we experience what happens and how we respond to what happens. And that was a big shift in terms of mindset, because everyone's out there thinking, oh, they can make whatever they want happen and we could do a whole call on this and I'll challenge anyone on that path. So anyway, building block number one practicing mindfulness.

Speaker 2:

Building block number two optimizing your time. Time is finite and most people value money over time. I go in the opposite direction. I teach how to value time over money. Three is cultivating relationship and what I've learned over 32 years of coaching agents real estate is a relationship driven business. Cultivating relationships is job one for any real estate agent who wants to build a thriving practice. Building block number four is implementing standards. We adjust to the standards we set in life. If we set a higher standard, we adjust ourself up to that standard. We set a lower standard, we adjust down, and most people think if they raise their standards, they're going to do less business. It's actually the opposite when you raise your standards, you're going to end up doing more business because you have to raise every level of your performance to that standard.

Speaker 2:

Next is mastering communication, and this is where Chris Voss came in. Chris wrote a book many of you may have read called Never Split the Difference, and a client gave it to me Again. This was about nine years ago now and that was another game changer for me and I reached out to Chris directly. We started doing work together and Chris created in the world of hostage negotiation. He was the former lead international hostage negotiator for the FBI for seven years and he created a methodology called tactical empathy.

Speaker 2:

And tactical empathy is the art of influencing others by articulating what they're thinking and feeling, without necessarily agreeing, disagreeing or sympathizing. And basically, what tactical empathy is? The skill of making people feel understood. And again, when I read this book, I did 180 degree shift in terms of how I was coaching agents, and we can get into that in a little bit. So, mastering communication building block five. And then the last building block acting strategically. It's not about working harder, it's not about acting on impulse or instinct. It's about acting strategically, and so those are the six core building blocks that I coach my clients to every day.

Speaker 1:

And one of the things that. So I pay attention quite a bit to Tony Robbins, right, and he talks about if you want to change your life, change your standards, right, and so what I'm hearing is something very similar in that relative to the real estate practice in terms of so, when we talk about standards, are you talking about goals or are you talking about how you operate and the team you build? Can you tell me a little bit more about that?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and this is a really important distinction, because everyone thinks in terms of goals. The problem with a goal is you're not in control of the outcome. The only thing we control in life is what goes on inside Our thoughts, our feelings, our words, our actions, our decisions. We have no control over the external world, and so people are setting goals all the time. That they have no control over and this is one of the challenges in real estate is that you only get paid for your results and yet you're not in control of the outcome of your efforts. It's a big challenge, and so, instead of goals, I talk about standards, because standards you do have control over.

Speaker 2:

Standards are how you show up in life and how you operate in life, and specifically in real estate, we want to set standards around time, how we spend our time off, which is critical, which most agents struggle with. They get into this. It's interesting the reason why most people get into real estate three reasons they want to earn a six-figure income or a seven-figure income, they want to be their own boss and they want freedom and flexibility. And they get into the business and they struggle with all three of those things, especially the freedom and flexibility part. They end up working 24-7 and they're on call all the time, and so we want to set standards around how we spend our time, how we take our time off. We want to set standards around the clients we work with and the clients we're not going to work with. We want to set standards around the commission that we charge. We want to have standards for how we spend our money, and these are some basic standards. Again, all of these things are in our control, and if we raise our standard in each of these areas, then it forces us to perform at a higher level. So I like to focus on the idea of standards rather than setting goals like an income goal and how many homes I'm going to sell, because, in truth, there are three forces.

Speaker 2:

Let me back up for a second. Real estate is an industry that focuses exclusively on one thing production. Agents are measured by their production, they're ranked by their production and they're paid by their production and, in essence, they're turned into a commodity. So it's all about production, and there's way more to this business than that one dimension of production. One of the things that I coach to how you do business is much more important than how much business you do, and it's not that more is bad. It's how you get to more. That's important, and that's what the six building blocks are all about.

Speaker 1:

So say more about how you do business. Right the issue most agents.

Speaker 2:

What they're doing every day is they're chasing after a deal. They show up and react to whatever shows up in their life and they're chasing after bright, shiny objects, anything they think might lead them to a deal. The problem with that is you're going to be chasing for the next 30 years. Real estate is a 30 plus year career and chasing is an addiction. And with any addiction, the idea oh, I just need one more deal. If you're a real estate agent, just think to yourself. How many times have you said to yourself oh, I just need one more deal. If I can just get one more deal, I'll be okay. Yeah, and you're okay until you need that next deal. And so how you do business, it's not about more. Again, the how part are the six building blocks, and each of those building blocks acts as a guardrail to keep you on path, keep you on a path to working in a certain way where you're not chasing, you're not working 24 seven, you're not giving away your money all in a desperate attempt to get a paycheck.

Speaker 1:

Gotcha Okay, and so that and that is the acting strategically part is being very purposeful and intentional about how you are spending time.

Speaker 2:

Yes, Exactly what we do is we take people through what we call a sales audit and again, this is going to be primarily for a more seasoned agent. I'll get into the new agent in a second seasoned agent. I'll get into the new agent in a second. The more seasoned agent. We want to look at their history of transactions and there's a definite pattern where 50% or more of their business comes from some segment of the market, whether it's geographic, whether it's demographic, whether it's a price point, whether it's a price point, whether it's a property type, whether it's a client type. And we want to identify we call that their green zone, their sweet spot, and that's where we want to focus all their efforts in the area where they already have a competitive advantage.

Speaker 2:

All business is not equal. There's good business and there's bad business, and most agents don't make a distinction, and so we break it down into green, yellow and red. There's your green zone. That's what you want to focus on. That's where 50% or more of your business is coming from. There's the yellow zone, which is business that's adjacent to your green zone. We'll do that business, but we're not pursuing that business. And then red zone is all the one-off stuff that doesn't add to your business at all and we're either going to refer that out or say no to it altogether. So acting strategically starts with identifying where's your business actually coming from, and we want to double down on that. I coach to the idea of going an inch wide and a mile deep. What most agents are doing. They're going a mile wide and an inch deep and just throwing as much up against the wall and hoping and praying something sticks. I don't coach to that at all.

Speaker 1:

It's interesting. So similar approach in real estate investing world. Right, you can send out, like I talk, I coach real estate investors and they'll tell me. I tried direct mail. It doesn't work. Okay, hang on one sec, tell me about that.

Speaker 1:

I sent out 5,000 cards to 5,000 different households, okay, and how many responses did you get? I got one, okay. How many times did you do that Once? Okay, so that's the problem.

Speaker 1:

You're better off picking 500 of your most of the properties that profile directly to what you are looking for in a G. So I do it geographically right. Stick to your neighborhood, stick to the area, and I would rather touch 500 people 10 times than 5000 people once. And what people find is that, from a branding perspective and ultimately from a relationship, you create awareness and then they get to know you and then they get to like you and then they trust you to take care of them when they need to sell their house or need to do something else. And it's amazing the relationships you can create when you just consistently focus on a very narrow slice of the market, because I refer to it as and it's a phrase that I borrowed from an old boss of mine but you're sucking the oxygen out of that market so that the only when it comes time to sell a property, sell your property.

Speaker 2:

You're the obvious choice right and that's why my coaching has evolved to repeat and referral, because that's what real estate is, has evolved to repeat and referral because that's what real estate is. It's a repeat and referral business and, however, most agents they're out there trying to lead, generate and lead convert all the time. They're just fascinated by the idea of getting new business. However, it's really hard to grow your business without that repeat and referral aspect of things to grow your business without that repeat and referral aspect of things.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I mean on the residential side of our business, we've done business with three realtors over the last 12 years and one of them we did business. She just passed away, unfortunately, but we did business with her for nine of that and we've done millions and I don't even know how many it's got to be in excess of $10 million worth of business with that one realtor. And it became easy because I trusted her. First and foremost. She was probably one of your prototypical clients in terms of how she showed up, how professional she was, how prepared she was, and the fact is that she gave me the straight dope when I asked hard questions, which is invaluable in this business.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, man, you just use the magic word trust, and again in. In residential real estate, every force imaginable is conspiring to turn agents into commodities, and you hear it all the time. You've got to know your value and you've got to articulate your value and you've got to convince people of your value. That just makes you into a commodity. There's always someone who's going to offer to do more for less. It's simply a race to the bottom. What people will pay for is trust. That's what they will pay for, and it's not about value, it's about trust, and you have to build that trust up over time by staying in touch with people again and again. It's real simple.

Speaker 2:

One of the things I talk about cultivating relationship. That's job one for a residential real estate agent, and what that means is getting your sphere together, whatever that looks like, the people that you're going to be in contact with whether it's a hundred people, 500, a thousand, that's up to you and these are the people that you're going to reach out to every 90 days. I preach CRM contact management systems. Everyone needs to use a CRM, and there's three parts to CRM A getting the right people in. B getting them set up on the right cadence. And C, making your calls every day to those people. Again, this is not rocket science, and if you do that consistently over time, you're going to grow a repeat and referral business. That is extremely rewarding and fulfilling, but it's not again chasing bright, shiny objects.

Speaker 1:

Right, it's not all. The world's a nail and you're one big hammer swinging away, exactly. You mean, we require sleep. For God's sakes, you got to pick your battles at some point. All right, steve, so this has been. I could talk for hours with you about this stuff. I've learned so much already, so, thank you. Now I'm going to put you on the spot, though, and take you through our final five. Okay, to put you on the spot, though, and take you through our final five. Simple lightning round. Just finish these. Just tell me what comes to mind when I ask the question. So the first thing I want to know, about.

Speaker 2:

is your purpose? What is your purpose? My purpose is to help people succeed in life. That's my purpose, plain and simple.

Speaker 1:

And usually the most simple are the best right, Because it's easy to follow and it gives clarity. I'm also very curious about and you've had a very unique professional experience, from professional athlete to working on Wall Street and now real estate and ultimately coaching. Invariably you've had multiple mentors over the years, so I'm curious about the best advice you ever got and who gave it to you.

Speaker 2:

The best advice I ever got from a client a long time ago, and that advice is this the only advice you need in life is the advice you give others. I love that and I live by that.

Speaker 1:

Interesting. Okay, so what about? I think we learn in order to be successful, you've got to be continuously learning, and I would submit that, at least for me. I think we learn. In order to be successful, you've got to be continuously learning, and I would submit that, at least for me. I learned more from my mistakes than I do from my successes, and so I'm curious about a professional mistake that you've made, a decision that you'd like to have back, and how'd you recover from it?

Speaker 2:

I don't think there's anything I'd like to have back. I've failed miserably. I fail every day. Sure, yeah, that's just life the way I look at it. If you're not failing, you're not trying, period. I think the mistake that I would say is thinking the grass is greener elsewhere. You know what I've learned now. The grass may be greener elsewhere. The lawn is just as hard to mow. Focus on where you are and give your best, your highest and best, to the moment that's unfolding in front of you. It's not greener anywhere else. Do your?

Speaker 1:

thing where you're doing it. My grandfather always used to tell me bloom where you're planted. There you go Bingo. Yeah, leaders like yourself, almost invariably, are readers, and so I'm curious about how you continue to improve and learn. What books are you reading right now? What authors or creators are you paying attention to?

Speaker 2:

For me. I like to read the same books again and again because every time I read them I'm in a different place and I'm going to hear things differently. And so Michael Singer, untethered Soul Living Untethered, the Surrender Experiment, any podcast that he does. I'm a lifelong student of Michael Singer, so that's my recommendation to people.

Speaker 1:

Right on. Okay, fill in this sentence for me, and then we're going to dismount from the final five. Okay.

Speaker 2:

Success means Success means living with joy. That's what success means Living with joy. We are meant to be joyful and yet most of us are letting fear run our life. And if you can make the shift from letting go of your fear to being curious and open about whatever life is going to give you because, again, we don't dictate what happens in life, we only dictate how we experience it and how we respond to it and if we can experience joy in everything we do and respond with joy, we're going to have an incredible life. And everything we do and respond with joy we're going to have an incredible life.

Speaker 1:

Couldn't agree more. So, steve, I've really enjoyed the conversation. Thank you so much for joining us today. So, steve, I've really enjoyed this conversation. You are a wealth of information. Thank you so much for sharing your experience and your expertise with us. I'm curious when you're not spending time with your real estate agent clients, what do you like to do for fun?

Speaker 2:

I've got two girls, twin girls that are 19. They're both in college and so love spending time with them. My family and I really do love thinking about getting back to my purpose in life helping people succeed. So it's always this constant journey of trying to figure out what is that code of success. So it's just an absolute passion of mine. I feel lucky that I get to wake up every day and do what I do. That's a little bit of who I'm about.

Speaker 1:

As a girl dad, I have a 22 year old and a 17 year old. I'm right there, brother. If people want to learn more about you or your practice performance coaching, what is the best way to reach you?

Speaker 2:

Best way go to the website wwwperformancecoachingcom. You can email us at support at performancecoachingcom. The three books I have are all on Amazon. The Full Fee Agent Real Estate Is Not Rocket Science and the Real Estate Team Playbook.

Speaker 1:

We'll certainly have you back to talk about those other two books, and we could talk for days about your practice and what you bring to the table. But for now, thank you very much. It's a pleasure to meet you and thank you for joining us on the show today.

Speaker 2:

I appreciate your time and everyone. Have a great end of the year and a great new year. Thank you.

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