Real Estate Underground

From X Games Gold to 3,300 Multifamily Units with Dan Brisse

• Ed Mathews • Season 5 • Episode 197

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What does it take for a professional snowboarder, six X Games appearances, gold and silver medals, fifteen years on tour, to land in real estate? For Dan Brisse, the answer was watching the guys five and ten years ahead of him lose their houses, their cars, and worse.

That was the wake-up call. While most of his peers spent every pay raise on the biggest house they could buy, Dan was reading books and buying apartments. By the time his snowboarding career ended, he had 70-some units already producing passive income.

Today Dan co-leads Granite Towers Equity Group, a 3,300-unit multifamily portfolio focused on Dallas-Fort Worth, Nashville, and select Minnesota submarkets. The playbook is disciplined: newer assets (1985 and up), 140 to 300 units, $20 to $40 million purchase price, 95%+ occupancy submarkets with real pent-up demand. Eighty-twenty split with LPs. Sixty-five to seventy-five percent loan-to-value, fixed rate, non-recourse. CapEx raised liquid up front, so the bank cannot force a bad spend.

What you'll hear:

  • The chairlift moment that reframed every financial decision Dan has made since
  • Why 78% of pro athletes are broke within three years of retirement and the side-hustle move he made to avoid joining them
  • The Cleburne, Texas case study: $6.75M acquisition, $2.1M LP raise, full-cycle returns
  • A second case study where interior upgrades and water conservation drove a 1.8x equity multiple in two years
  • Why Dan believes we are in a generational buying window with multifamily trading at 30-40% discounts versus 2021-22 peaks
  • His sharpest definition of wealth, and why "rich" and "wealthy" aren't the same thing

Learn more about Granite Towers Equity Group: https://www.granitetowersequitygroup.com/contact-us

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Cold open

Dan Brisse

but the biggest thing that changed my life when I was riding up a chairlift was the realization that I don't have to work to get paid. I could put my money to work, and it pays me whether I'm working or not working.

Ed Mathews

If you're within three feet of me, we're probably talking about real estate, much to my family's chagrin. But here's the thing, most people see 7% rates and freeze. I see opportunity. They're waiting for the perfect deal, and well, I've analyzed thousands of them, and perfect just doesn't exist. So I talk to operators across every asset class, flippers, multifamily syndicators, note investors, and whatever else is working. No sales pitches allowed, just real lessons from people actually doing it.

Welcome and intro

Ed Mathews

I'm Ed Mathews, and this is Real Estate Underground. Greetings and salutations, real estate undergrounders. It is Ed Mathews with the Real Estate Underground. Thank you so much for making us a part of your day. As I usually start the show, I- if you're not subscribing please do 'cause it helps us grow and helps us reach other people. The second thing, and the most important though, is s- keep those comments coming, because I wanna know about the things that you're thinking about as we go into 2026. How is artificial intelligence affecting this business? How is the inflationary rate, the geopolitical ra- s- situation, all of that? Keep those questions coming, 'cause it helps us decide who we bring on the show to answer those questions. And with that I am joined by Dan Breese of Granite Towers Equity Group. He is based in Washington State, one of my favorite places. It's, that's God's country out there. And Dan, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for your time today.

Dan Brisse

Yeah, Ed, thanks. Excited to be here with you.

Ed Mathews

Yeah, right on. For those folks that don't know who you are and what you do, why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself?

Dan Brisse

Yeah, you bet. So like many of your listeners, when I was young, I had big dreams as a kid, and I really wanted to be a professional snowboarder. So being

Becoming a pro snowboarder

Dan Brisse

young and pretty naive, I would go out and tell everyone how I'm gonna be this big athlete and travel the world and be on TV. And, most people pushed back pretty hard. I got a lot of teachers who would ask me what my backup plan was or, "Do you realize there's no mountains in Minnesota?" 'Cause I grew up in Minnesota. And honestly, it was a bit discouraging, and I can still remember bringing it to two leaders that I had in my life at that time, and one of them looked me direct in the eyes and he said, "Go for it. You can do it." Awesome. He said, "It's not gonna be easy." He said, "It's probably gonna take more work than you think it is. You're gonna have to have grit." But he was He said, "Go for it." And the other one said, "Do what you love." And, those were my parents. And so- I think about, just the power of parents that have to put belief into a child or at least give them the platform to chase something. And, for me, when I first learned about snowboarding, I really didn't know what it would take. I didn't know the effort I'd have to go through. I didn't know how much time it would take. I just knew I really loved to snowboard. But after a few years of riding and learning that there was professional snowboarding, I could see, it's a possibility. And again, with my parents' belief, I took it out west to Salt Lake City and pursued this snowboarding career. And, first year I thought I'd be this big name athlete. And again, my parents supported me, but there was no capital or no money funding, so it was all on my own. So I'm eating peanut butter and jelly for breakfast, lunch, and dinner, and I'm working at Blockbuster, and I'm snowboarding every day, and I'm working at night. Year one goes by, nothing really happens. Year two, I come back, I go back to Minnesota to work, save money work for my dad. I come back year two and I think this is my year. Again, peanut butter and jelly breakfast, lunch, and dinner. I'm working at Red Lobster. Nothing happens. And I go back year three and come back, and I have a major knee injury before anything even happens- Wow in a snowboarding career. Yeah, I had a dislocated kneecap. I tore my meniscus, and my season ended right there. And it was at that moment, for me, I... or if I wasn't, didn't have a burning desire or committed to this goal, and, one of my leadership coach now says, "Commitment moves the world," and I couldn't agree with that more. So at that moment in time, it was either quit and go to college or buckle down, get through this knee injury, and come back next year, and that's what I did. I went and biked and rehabbed, came back

Aspen Open and the 15-year run

Dan Brisse

year four, and my good friend says, "Dan, there's a contest in Aspen. You should go Aspen, Colorado, and compete in the Aspen Open." And an open is really a cool event where anyone in the country who thinks they're good can show up, pay your 250 bucks for an entry fee. You get two runs. If you finish top 10, you go to finals. If you don't, you go home. I end up finishing sixth at the Aspen Open and as the qualifier, and I go home that night to my hotel, visualize my run. I come back the next day, and I don't know what happened to the other guys, but I end up winning this contest, and my snowboarding career just takes off. And I ended up having a 15-year run traveling the world. It was ended up being a dream come true. I was on every cover of every snowboard magazine, and I was in X Games six times. X Games is in Aspen. And I ended up winning a couple gold medals and a couple silver medals. And this huge blow-up happens, but the crazy part with the transition to real estate for me was when I was at the top, I could see the end, and I could see what was happening to a lot of guys who became my friends who were 5 or 10 years in front of me. And I saw them losing their homes. I saw them losing their cars. I saw them going back to the grocery store, busing or

Watching peers go broke: the wake-up call

Dan Brisse

bagging groceries. Yeah. One of my good friends ended up committing suicide just because- Oh my the identity shift was so strong. And so when I saw that happen, that was my wake-up call of saying, "Okay, great work so far, and it's not gonna get you much further past your snowboarding career if you're not smart with the money you're making." Yeah. So that was my wake-up call and an introduction to real estate investing.

Ed Mathews

Awesome. Wow, what a story, man. it's interesting you talk about having that plan afterward because, we've had professional football players on this show, we've had a couple of baseball players and they all talk about the exact same thing, which is, what's next? Because, the fact is that when your body can't perform at the level that you need to be, competing in those types of events brain still works. You're a young man. You're probably in your mid to late, m- mid-30s at worst, right? And having that next step is so important. It's also hugely important when you're trying to break out of y- you know, your W-2 world, right? And because, going out on your own and starting a business and building a team and all that is, it's really hard. And, having that plan post corporate career most people don't do it 'cause it's absolutely terrifying, right? Yeah. Yeah. And had to be terrifying putting down the competitive snowboard. Now you just do it for fun, I assume.

Dan Brisse

Yeah. Yeah, like, when I hear you talk right now it brings me back to the transition because when that transition happened in my life, and for any listeners that are listening now, they may see a transition coming, retirement may be coming, maybe they just don't like what they're doing. Yeah. That fear of that transition was real, and it was uncomfortable. The stat is that 78% of all pro athletes are broke within three years of retirement. Yep. And so what I would suggest for anyone who may be in the situation that I was in, start something part-time while you're still in your career. That was the best thing I did is I got ahead of it by starting to buy apartments while I was still a professional athlete, a professional snowboarder, so when my

Buying 70 units while still on tour

Dan Brisse

career ended I had 70-some units ready to go, creating passive income. And, so that was my way transitioning, and if anyone hears that, you don't have to make it a cut, "I'm quitting work and throwing everything in." I like the idea of, "Okay, I'm gonna start some new things on the side and keep my life pretty dang stable." And that transition, you'll know when the time is right to jump and, that, that happened for me too.

Ed Mathews

Yeah. I, not a professional athlete, but I, when I was in corporate America I was slinging software and I was building a a, I was building my own portfolio on the side, nights and weekends and occasionally during the day, right? Don't tell my boss. But the fact is that by the time I got to the point where I was ready to do this the cashflow was already there. So it wasn't a huge financial hit to be able to kind of transition over. Yeah. Y- you, you have the relationships. I would imagine you accumulated sponsors and, and all that. And you knew a bunch of high-powered people that may or may not have dabbled in real estate. Was that what drove you to real estate or was it something else?

Dan Brisse

No. Yeah, I, a lot of the folks in the snowboarding world a lot of the owners of the companies are really obsessed with their company and building their company, and not a lot of them had experience with real estate. What really changed for me is I started reading books on what to do with the money I was making, because that's really the biggest thing is you go out and make good money as an athlete, and now what do you do with it? You save it and let inflation rip apart, or what do you do? And so what I learned three things, and these three things changed my life, and these are the three things we at Granite Towers Equity Group do every day. It's what we're looking for every day. Yeah. First one was passive income. How do I make my money work for me where I have multiple streams of income flowing in, whether I work or don't work? Never heard that term until I was 28, passive income. Number two, how do we hedge inflation? Like the dollar's being printed. There is no question about that. The destruction of our currency is real, it is happening, and I think people are really seeing it now. So how do you hedge inflation? And then third, how do you get depreciation? And depreciation for me was something, again, I never heard, but depreciation is powerful if you can use it correctly to legally reduce your tax bill. So those three things really were the the mindset shifts that changed everything for me.

Ed Mathews

Yeah, depreciation is i- it's the... If Einstein called compound in- interest the eighth wonder, I would say that depreciation is the ninth. Yeah. The fact is that the reason that depreciation exists is because the government wants to elicit behavior, and that behavior is guys like you and me and the folks listening out in the audience, To create affordable housing f- and higher end housing for f- either hardworking folks or folks who are just getting out of school and looking to launch their career. And in both cases, they're not ready to buy. They're, they're gonna rent. And so you want, clean, safe well-appointed homes that folks can live in, whether that be condos or apartment buildings or single family homes or whatever, whatever the whatever your passion

Granite Towers: DFW, Nashville, Minnesota

Ed Mathews

is. So Granite is focused predominantly on multifamily, if I'm not mistaken, right?

Dan Brisse

Yep. At Granite Towers we're mainly focused on multifamily value add. Our main markets are Dallas-Fort Worth and Nashville. And then Mike and I growing up in Minnesota have a few select sub-markets we'll buy in Minnesota. Pretty particular about location up there for obvious reasons. Sure. Yeah, with, for us it's 100% finding assets that fit our criteria and then it's doing a great job with asset management. The other part of our company that's newer in the last few years is triple net lease deals as well. Some of our investors have came to us and said, "Hey, can you bring me very consistent cash flow and massive depreciation?" So we do car washes, and we're looking at some gas stations. But car washes fit into a provision in the tax code that gets you very large depreciation losses.

Ed Mathews

Absolutely. Yeah. No, and it's huge because I... And I would assume those folks are high earners who are looking to defray the costs or the taxes on their- day-to-day income by- investing in real estate and taking the depreciation, right?

Dan Brisse

Yeah. Yeah, you bet. I could give you guys I love sharing a real life story of depreciation- Yeah, please do for me. And, when I was an athlete as a snowboarder And I'll talk about today only things we've done, case studies. I'm looking at things. When I listen to podcasts, I'm always like why would I listen to this person? Who is it?" And I like to listen to people who have done it, who've created it, and have the success to show. So this story here on my depreciation, it's a real-life story and a real-life case study. Back in 2015 as a professional athlete I'm making right around 325,000 a year. I look back at that, I'm a little embarrassed that's all it was. But for me, coming from making nothing, make- eating peanut butter and jelly, 325 grand was a nice increase. And during my- A little bit yeah, before I had any real estate depreciation, my real estate losses were zero, and I had expenses. I was smart enough to at least set up an LLC, and I had 72,000 of expenses for running the company. So my taxable income that year was 253,000, and I owed 52 grand in tax. Ooh. And when I was, yeah, cruising along, my CPA said, "Hey, can you Does your wife," who I'm married now, "Does she have a job she loves, or what does she do?" And my wife is working at a restaurant as a server, and I'm like, "Do you like what you're doing?" And she says, "No, I hate it." And so my CPA says great. Have her manage your properties. You got 65, 70 units. Have her do some of the accounting, have her walk the properties, have her oversee some of the CapEx, and as long as she has 750 hours, she can qualify as a real estate professional." So she immediately drops into that role, quits her job, and my gross income, again, here's the story, is you got 325,000. Now I can take my real estate depreciation losses of 140,000 because of cost segregation studies and phantom losses, minus my same expenses of 72 grand, and now my taxable income's 113 grand. So federal tax owed now is 17 grand. So I sa- I saved 35,000 that year alone that I could take and invest into fut- those investments

RE professional status and depreciation

Dan Brisse

at that time. And the time of compounded money, it adds up tremendously. And I can tell you right now, my wife wasn't making 35 grand doing what she was doing. If you can qualify as a real estate professional or you can get yourself positioned in the right quadrant to take depreciation, it just accelerates your ability to build wealth.

Ed Mathews

Yeah, and you get Uncle Sam to pay your your wife's salary, basically.

Dan Brisse

That's it. That's perfect. And she's having a lot more fun doing it. Yeah, you bet.

Ed Mathews

Exactly. Okay, and so let's talk about your buy box. We talked about markets Texas Minneapolis, Minnesota. T- talk to me about what you're looking for.

Dan Brisse

Yeah. We're looking for currently newer assets, 1985, 1990 or newer.

Ed Mathews

Okay.

Dan Brisse

Typically 140, 150 units up to 300. We're in that $20 to $40 million purchase price. Got it. Nice value add play in markets that have pent-up demand or extreme pent-up demand, and I would say anything above, 95% occupancy aligns for that. We're looking

The buy box: 140-300 units, 1985+, 95%+ occupancy

Dan Brisse

for locations where we own other assets. We have 3,300 units in our portfolio, so we're looking to be in specific sub-markets that help us get economies of scale. So all of that comes into play. And, biggest thing I would just share with you guys, again, going back to the passive income piece that changed my life, is for listeners that don't understand how to create it, and I don't know if you've got listeners here that are looking for more passive income, but the biggest thing that changed my life when I was riding up a chairlift was the realization that I don't have to work to get paid. I could put my money to work, and it pays me whether I'm working or not working. And it's investing to build wealth versus spending to stay broke. I had a, fortunate that I wouldn't... I got these nice pay increases, and I didn't go spend it all. Where a lot of the athletes or a lot of the high earners that I was with, they would get these pay increases, and then boom, they'd go buy the biggest house they could. Yeah. So that's where if you can delay some gratification, and you can invest it into real estate, now you can get your capital to start paying you, and you can see that residual income. We do that with most of our deals. That's one of our main staples with anything we're buying is cash flow. And so if you want a case study on that, we can go into more detail there, or otherwise we can keep it moving. Absolutely. I'd love

Ed Mathews

that. Yeah, please.

Dan Brisse

Yeah. So a deal, again, this is full cycle, something we purchased and added value and exited. And the way it worked out was it's a Cleburne, Texas asset 88 units. We acquired it September of 2019 for 6.75 million, and we raised $2.1 million from our limited partners, our database. Yeah. And then we sold it October 2021 because at that time the market was ripping and multifamily was on fire, and we ended up at, of an exit of 12.1 million. And but the biggest point- Nice I wanted to share here for you guys is that the passive income along the way averaged a 12% cash on cash. And the way we returned that was when we bought the deal, we ended up bringing in $500,000 of CapEx money that we invested into the property. And so we upgraded the property to be competitive with the comps. So it's not really rocket science, before

Cleburne case study: $6.75M to exit

Dan Brisse

we bought the deal, we do a thorough due diligence so you know what the asset really needs compared to the competitors. And if you can get into a submarket where the competitor's occupancy is 95 or higher or really extreme pent-up demand like that, there's not a lot of options for people to go, as long as you don't have a bunch of new permits coming online. And so we ended up relocating the office as a value add strategy. We put extra LED lighting throughout the whole property. It reduced our utility bill and lit up the property nicely for safety. We put in 48 backyards on this 88 unit deal, which allows residents to have more space, maybe have a pet and be able to go outside with privacy. We did interior unit upgrades, and we did a water conservation program throughout the whole property. In a water conservation program, we hire a company to come in, they replace all the toilets, aerators on the faucets, and it just reduces our water bill significantly and helps us drive our net operating income. So with completing that CapEx plan, we're now able to create a cash flow, scenario. So if someone puts in $100,000 for round numbers, they're receiving about 12,000 a year from that deal as cash flow. And so for me, when I was looking at exiting my snowboarding career, my whole goal, and still my goal, is how much can I get my passive income to exceed my living standard or my monthly expenses to create wealth? And I love how simple that is, and I hope more people can hear that because I get a lot of... The question I get all the time is, how do you actually become wealthy? How do you become rich? And so rich is a little different, but wealthy is when your passive income exceeds your expenses. And once you have that, you've got freedom. So that's how real estate incorporates into our investing portfolio to help create passive income and freedom ideally.

Ed Mathews

Yeah. It's I'm so glad you said, you told that s- that case study because, basically what you just laid out is a playbook that you can execa- execute property after property- after property, right?

Dan Brisse

Yeah.

Ed Mathews

The lights, the water the water retention or water savings all the things that you just laid out, that's a checklist. For anyone who's out there investing or thinking about it, the playbook you just heard is exactly what you should be doing with every single property y- you're acquiring So thank

Dan Brisse

you. Yeah, you bet. And you guys the biggest thing is if it sounds overwhelming, you can get with companies that have done this and be along for the ride on one or two deals. And we're not special. Anyone could go do this. You're gonna wanna get some training. You're gonna have someone to kinda help you guide through, your first one or two of these things, and there is a lot of management once you take over. But it's available to anybody. Anybody could've went and bought this deal and implemented the CapEx plan just like we did, and exited and made a lot of capital, a lot of income or a lot of capital gains for a lot of our investors. And the piece of what that is, once you get the capital gains, what are you gonna do with the capital? Because we're all in the same boat. Are you gonna reinvest it, do another cost segregation study for depreciation? Are you gonna refinance tax-free and hold? That, all that stuff can be taken into consideration with the right operator, and it should be.

Ed Mathews

Yeah, so say more about that. So when you sell, I, I notice you, on your site you've gotten... You've disposed of about seven different deals, Yeah over the course of time. And obviously, when you're doing accelerated depreciation or depreciation of any kind, actually, there's a ca- there's a recapture there at the end if you don't plan right. And so planning right means what? Yeah. Talk to me about what

Dan Brisse

or

Ed Mathews

how you do that.

Dan Brisse

Yeah, you bet. So when we're buying deals, and you guys, we've learned a lot of lessons over the years of doing this. I bought my first property in 2012. We started our company in 2017. Here we are in 2026. We're coming into year nine, and have done 31 deals. Seven have gone full cycle. A lot of really great deals, a lot of really big performing deals, and we've had a couple struggling properties. And the piece I would just touch on, you guys, is as you're around and as you're in this company and in this business looking to invest with folks, I would really strongly, I would strongly urge you to find companies that have been through a recession, have been through something- Absolutely and are still here. Yes. Because the lessons you're gonna get during that time are absolutely invaluable. Even our company from 2021 to now, we're not even in the same playing field. We've added such different pieces of criteria and principles and team members with experience. The shakeout of 2022 to now, a lot of companies that were here are not here. Absolutely. And a lot of those A players, yeah, most are not here. And those A players that were at those companies, they're looking for homes. And if you can absorb some of those A players like we have from a lot of the competitors who used to be here, it allows you to, A, learn some incredible lessons, and B, bring in some of the best A players to now enjoy this next ride. 'Cause the cycle's really resetting is this consensus, and I'm in a lot of mastermind with a lot of big-name investors, a lot of economists. And the consensus is that, yeah, we've seen a lot of pain since late '21, early '22, and things have kinda flattened, and now we're starting to see the recovery happen. And a lot of the new supply that was being built is now being absorbed. And so we have likelihood of rates coming down. That's, we all think that rates are gonna come down with how active Trump is, right? Fingers are crossed. And obviously there's always a possibility that they don't, but the indicators are looking very likely that rates will come down. When rates come down, cap rates generally follow and the values are gonna kinda start to boost. Hey, if you're looking to be buying, it's interesting to me, and I'm sure you saw this too, when I look back at '21 or '22 when so many people were FOMOing in, they had the fear of missing out and frenzying in and it was really the riskiest time. And I think about Warren Buffett, he said, "When people are fearful, be greedy." And right now it's fear. And when people are greedy, which was back in '21, early '22, be fearful. So the reality is back then, liquidate, be fearful. Here you are now and people are actually scared, and is the time to be buying. And we're seeing a lot of big capital of highly educated folks looking at a lot of data who are now coming back into the market. I don't know if I answered your question clearly. I- You did. Okay. Great.

Ed Mathews

Yeah. You nailed it. Yeah, it's, and the- Data shows if you look at the last handful of downturns, whether it's the 20- 2021, '22 coming out of COVID

Cap rate vs. cost of debt, market cycles

Ed Mathews

you're looking at 2007, 8, 9, or 8, 9, 10 really. If you look at, heck, even go further back, right? '91, '88 the late '70s, I think '77, right? '78, '79. The best times, the biggest companies today were founded right in the teeth of those downtimes, and the reason being is exactly what Dan just said, right? Is that the talent of some of these c- that are in some of these companies are leaving because the companies are shutting down, and it's a great opportunity to staff up and bring in, some really special people, which sets you up to accelerate right through as the cycle kind of matures and goes right back into growth, which I agree with Dan. I think we're, right on the cusp of some additional good times. You know- Yeah. It may not be 2019 ever again in our lifetime, but it doesn't have to be. The fact is that for me and Dan, I'll ask you to comment on this, for me, I'm looking for a two-point spread. If I can get, a two-point spread between what my cap rate is and what my cost of debt is, that's a good deal, right? And I don't necessarily have to get there day one, but if I'm, six, six months, 12 months, I've got to be able to get there, but what are your thoughts?

Dan Brisse

Yeah I think that's a great criteria piece if you can find it, you can meet it. The piece that we're seeing right now is 30 to 40% discounts compared to where pricing was back in '21 and '22. And so if you're seeing a 30 to 40% discount four years later after where pri- property was peaking, we think we're coming in at a great cost per basis. And, the other piece to add to what you shared, Ed, is a lot of these companies that were buying when things were challenging did so well because they're buying stuff at such a discount. And this is a great way to hedge inflation as investors, and this is something I'm glad we're gonna touch on here before we wrap it up, I'm sure we're not too far away, is the inflationary piece that we're seeing happen in America right now and really across the world with currency disruption is

Inflation thesis and the 84-unit deal

Dan Brisse

absolutely terrible to see, and it's not gonna get better. It's gonna get worse. And, it's unlikely that the dollar starts to gain value. They will continue to print based on history. Readers, if listeners haven't read it, read Changing World Order by Ray Dalio. Ray Dalio is a hedge fund billionaire. He's old. Yeah. Been through cycles. He's done very well with his company. He wrote a book, Changing World Order, purely data driven. And this book will change likely your perspective on where we're going, and you wanna get that information sooner rather than later because it's very likely based on history, based on data, the US is heading towards more money printing, more inflation. And the way you can get on the side of inflation is that you can actually benefit from it is by owning things that are real. And I- and I'll give you one more quick case study- Yeah as an investor of how we're hedging inflation. And so we're buy- we bought an 84-unit deal. Purchase price was only 4.75 million, sale price of 6.75 million. And what we did here, same exact as I just shared with our Cleburne deal, we put in 420,000 for interior unit upgrades. We ended up painting the walls. We put in new cabinetry. We painted the cabinets actually. We put in new countertops. We put in new LED lightings, and we ended up upgrading interior units so that the residents in that sub-market would wanna pay more for rent. We put in a new playground to make it family-friendly. Again, we did a- Nice water conservation. Yeah, and so as we did that work, we were able to collect higher rent because there was true value given to that sub-market, and our residents wanted to live there with great property management. We drove net operating income when we exited, and we gave our investors a 1.8 equity multiple. And what that means is if you put 100 grand into the deal again, you're gonna get your 100 grand back plus 80,000 in gain, and that was over a two-year deal. And so- Wow. That's awesome that's not how every deal will necessarily go. I'm not here to say that. But I'm just saying that's how you can get on the side of inflation. And I think if you get into deals in these next two, three years, ideally in the next 12 to 24 months, you're gonna have a very likelihood chance of creating at least those kind of returns.

Ed Mathews

I agree. Yeah, that's impressive, man. Congratulations. So talk to me about your capital stack. What does that look like these... when you're going into these deals? How are you approaching, say, for instance, it sounds a lot of this is value add, right? So are you financing that value add, the construction, or are you using equity? What's your play there?

Dan Brisse

Yeah. No, for us, we raise all of the equity upfront for our CapEx plan before we close, and it's just cash sitting there. The reason we do that is it gives us more flexibility than what the bank may say. So bankers are very by the book, and the reality is that sometimes markets shift. So you go through due diligence and you figure out what the property needs, and then you, let's say you finance the CapEx through the lender, and it's lit- written in your loan docs, "This is what you have to spend." They're gonna push you to spend that money even though the property may not need it. Like you get into a property, we own a property and we go and spend $7,500

Capital stack, 80/20 splits, GP skin in the game

Dan Brisse

on upgrading a unit and we don't get any rent bump, that's a waste of money right now. Hold that capital. Sit down. Wait for the market to come back. If you're gonna spend 7,500 bucks, I want a f- $150 to $200 rent bump for the capital invested at least. And if you're not gonna get that, you gotta wait. Market will come back. Market will shift. New supply gets eaten up. Now you can invest it maybe in year three, bu- bump out 40 units and you've got a total different place. So for us, our capital stack is 100% CapEx raised, liquid. We're calling audibles. We're basing our decisions based off what the sub-market is telling us, the real time data. We do a 80/20 split on our deals. 80% of the cap- of the cashflow goes to the LP, limited partners, 20% to GP. You can see 70/30 split. You might see a 50/50 split. It's all over the board. But we just do an 80/20 straight split.

Ed Mathews

Okay. And then so I assume then that if you're doing an 80/20 that you're also putting in your own capital into the limited partner

Dan Brisse

side as

Ed Mathews

well.

Dan Brisse

Yeah. Yeah, you bet. Out of the capital that we'll raise I'll be an A share owner in the 80%. And all of us as general partners will be. Yeah, we're always investing every deal. Our leverage is generally 65 to 75% loan to value. We do fixed currently non-recourse. Usually it's Fannie or Freddie debt. And yeah it's just pretty base hit stuff.

Ed Mathews

Yeah. So as someone out there who would invest in, a project with Dan or someone like me or Dan or whoever else, that's something that I look for when I'm investing with other with other teams as well. 'Cause we, our capital here, a lot of our capital is with other operators, right? And the... one of the big things that I'm looking for is "Hey, Dan, where... Is your money in this deal, too?" And the ans- if the answer's yes, we keep talking. If the answer's no, we probably aren't a good fit, and that's fine, right? And, that's something that is very important 'cause you know-

Dan Brisse

100%. I couldn't agree more. You gotta believe in what you're buying, right? 100%. If you got people that are buying something and they don't see the value in it what, what's really going on? You gotta start raising your eyebrows when you hear that they're not investing in their deal that they went and found. And yeah I love investing in these deals and I've invested in 100% of the deals we've bought. My business partner is as well. Usually our partners, the general partners, will take about 10 to 15% of the equity of every deal. Nice. So yeah, if we're raising 10 million, we'll b- about 1 million to 1 million and a half. If we're raising 20, about 2 to 2 and a half, maybe 3.

Ed Mathews

Good. Yeah, it's a g- that's a great approach. And, it's probably gotta give a lot of comfort to your investors knowing that skin in the game is a real thing.

Dan Brisse

Yeah.

Ed Mathews

So- It

Dan Brisse

really is. It is indeed.

Ed Mathews

Okay let's get into the lightning round. The final five. One of the things that I'm always interested in is how leaders like yourself, how their brains work. At some point in your life, and I think you've surpassed this quite some time ago the financial situation is pretty, is solid, right? The bills are paid, the mortgage is handled. If you have kids the tuitions are paid for, yada, yada, yada, right? And nevertheless, you get up out of bed on Monday morning and go rocketing into the office for, one or more reasons. And I'm I l- I look at that as purpose. So what is your purpose? What gets you out of bed on Monday mornings?

Dan Brisse

Yeah. For me I really love personal growth, and I love... I'm excited to see what we're able to create at our company over the next, 30, 40 years. I'm 42 now, and my intention is to work until I'm 80. I wanna work in something that I love, and I've got a passion. And so building Granite Towers Equity Group, for me, is turning into my new passion. My snowboarding career was- Yeah and I was obsessed with it, and that's over, and now I'm here at Granite Towers. And I love the feeling of progress, and that journey of evolving as a person, as an entrepreneur, as a business owner is the part that's giving me the most excitement every day. And how do I become that person to emulate it for my kids? Because at the end of the day, I've got three

Purpose, belief, and the lightning round

Dan Brisse

children and I think they're gonna be more of, like, how I am. And so there's always that possibility of, "Hey, how can I be more efficient and show them a cleaner way so that they can take what I have and continue on?"

Ed Mathews

Yeah. So I'm a little bit older and my kids are a little bit older, but, one of the things that I've noticed in... And I coach- I'm a softball coach, so I coached hundreds of kids. And the thing that I've noticed about children is they emulate their parents. So if mom and dad have a g- a good work ethic, if mom and dad are high character kids are too, almost always. It's- Beautiful and so it's a good thing. I'm so glad to hear it. So congratulations on that, man. Thank you. So I'm curious about the mentors you've had in your life. I think you alluded to the fact that you have business coaches and I'm, a- and you also mentioned mentors earlier in the conversation. So I'm curious about the best advice you ever got and who gave it to you.

Dan Brisse

Yeah, gosh, that's a great question. Mentors for me have been massive from my snowboarding career to transitioning to be a business owner to leadership. You name it. I still, I probably would go with just some of the books I've read. Yeah. And, one of the quotes that really stands out to me every day is, "If you think you can or think you can't, you're right." And Henry Ford is the guy who said that. And I think when you slow it down and you start to think about that in more detail, I- it basically changes every single thing that you may be after, and it tests to see what do you think is possible. And so whether you think you can or think you can't is ri- right, resonates with me when we're looking at buying a deal, when we're looking at exiting, when we're looking at, a 10-year plan, when I'm looking at personal growth. So I really love that line, and I keep it close.

Ed Mathews

Yeah, there's something in quantum physics that I read not that long ago, and I'm a little bit of a geek. But actually, if you talk to my kids, they'll tell you I'm a very big geek. But the, and that is that a particle, quantum particle doesn't have a reality until it's observed. In other words, by me observing it, it creates that reality. And so that's true at that level, and it's also true at the level that we're at right now in terms of you create your own reality. And what you believe, what the story is in your head that you tell yourself first off, recognize it's not the truth. But secondly, you can change that. You can manage that to visualize and and then ultimately create the reality that you wanna live in, right? It is possible.

Dan Brisse

Yeah. Yeah, your belief governs your behavior. And your behavior compounds in results. So whatever you believe is going to change how you show up every day, and that is a compounding effect, and there's no two ways about it.

Ed Mathews

Yep, absolutely. Everything builds on everything. Talk to me about a decision that you'd love to have back, something you look back on and go, "Man, I didn't get that right." And what'd you do about it?

Dan Brisse

Yeah, for us, that's a tougher question for me to answer because there's decisions I'd love to have back but the problem with taking them back is I wouldn't have learned the lesson I needed to learn. Yeah. I'm, I... In the moment, it's painful. It sucks. And what it would be for us is buying a deal in a really rough market. Yeah. I would have not bought the deal again and not gone down that path. But on the very other side of it, we wouldn't have learned what we needed to learn to completely change our criteria and our principles at Granite Towers to make us a completely different firm. So that's my best answer I have on that.

Ed Mathews

It's a great answer because I fundamentally believe we learn more from the mistakes we make than from the successes we have, right? And the only way you sharpen that saw, the only way you get better is by stubbing your toe. Yep. I don't know, I do not know a successful person who if they turned around and showed you their shoulders, they don't have scars all over them, right? 100%. Yeah. It's not possible. So- No. Very so congrats to you to be smart enough to learn that.

Dan Brisse

Yeah.

Ed Mathews

100%. Yeah, right on. So I'm also curious about how you take in information. F- I, I'm a book reader, but, that's not the only way to consume. People go to conferences, network, meet people YouTube, whatever. How do you take in information, and who do you pay atten- who are you paying attention to, authors, creators, whatever these days?

Dan Brisse

Yeah. Yeah, I'm, I have a vast focus here. I read a lot of different books. I'm tuned i- to a lot of different articles that are in our real estate world a lot of podcasts. And I've noticed that as I'm aging, it's important for me to write down things that I'm reading to help it stick. And, whe- whether that's good or bad, it just is what it is. So- Reality, brother. Yeah, that's it. That's it. Yeah, you see that. You've got your yeah, journal. I got one right down here too. It's like- Yeah if I don't write it down- Yeah it doesn't stick as well. So it's a combination for me. A lot of mentors, a lot of mastermind groups, podcasts, books, or news specific big Marcus Millichap and CBRE and Bellwether. Yeah. They're always releasing their industry data, all the industry reports, but really cementing it in with writing.

Ed Mathews

Yeah. So talk to me about one, one thing you've read over the past, I don't know, three, six months that have really stuck with you.

Dan Brisse

Last three to six months I think the piece that would probably stand out the most is with where we are in the cycle. In talking... And cycles for me is what dictates and controls our company and where we're going, what we're doing, how active we're buying, and finding the confidence to be buying when there's potentially blood in the street. And the data and the stats that I keep seeing and reading and hearing about is that most, almost all of them, can't say all 'cause it could change and there may be things we're missing. There's always a possibility of that. But most of the data, strong majority of it, is that we're headed out and things are headed back up. And so for us, when we're still in the pain, which we are, what assets can we acquire at these massive discounts to really move the wealth for our investors, for us at Granite Towers, and put some very solid blocks in place at a great buying opportunity, a great window buying opportunity? These windows are not always open. Yeah. You look at any asset class, there are windows for buying and there are windows for selling, and we are in a unique window for buying opportunity, specifically for multifamily, for those that know what they're doing. And I'm excited about that. And yeah, and to keep hearing it from many different people who I respect tremendously, who have much more experience in this industry than of me, 30, 40, 50 years, who are all giving me direct data on what they're seeing and why they're seeing it, is a big vote of confidence.

Ed Mathews

Yep, 100%. I I always tell people that if I walk into a conference room and I'm the smartest person in the room, we're all screwed. And it's true, right? Surround yourself with with the people that that are a lot smarter, a little more experienced with you, and you can't help but be successful because they're gonna help you, right?

Dan Brisse

That's it. And they want to. These people- that have done really well and they're getting older they're excited to pass on their wisdom, to people who can handle it. And so iron sharpen i- iron sharpens iron. Get around in a room of people who are doing what you want, are further along than you are and become a great steward of information.

Ed Mathews

Yeah. And the thing is that, 99% of those human beings, they don't want anything from you. They just want you to succeed, and then ultimately do it for somebody else, right?

Dan Brisse

That's it. Yeah.

Ed Mathews

It's it... that's... Karma bank's a real thing, man. So okay. So talk to me about how you define success in your life.

Dan Brisse

Yeah, for me success is really a personal journey, of who do I have the potential to become. And, sticking with goals that excite me and accomplishing them, and I don't mean that to sound selfish in any way, shape, or form, but, in any way, shape, or form, but the reality is that nobody else could know what will make me happy. And so for me it's can I find a way to create major goals and succeed, and can you serve many along the way? Yeah. Jim Rohn's classic line is, "Service to many leads to greatness." Yeah. And and or maybe that's what Jim Rohn said, Je- John F. Kennedy said, "Service to many leads to greatness." So for us, for me at Granite Towers, it's about setting really big goals and making them come to reality, and serving those around who, who like what we're about and want to be on a ride with us.

Ed Mathews

Awesome. Congratulations on an amazing business that you've built. And now a second amazing career, so kudos to you on that as well. So when you're not talking about real estate, what do you like to do?

Dan Brisse

Yeah, for me it's g- I'm getting into golf more. I've got a- Oh,

Ed Mathews

you like pain. I get it. All right.

Dan Brisse

Yeah, I went from this great snowboarding career of high adrenaline, high risk. Then I got into dirt biking, motocross racing, and I had a serious injury and I just had a reality moment of my adrenaline days are winding down. Yeah. Let's take it into more of a methodical mental state. But I still want to be competitive, so golf's that game for me.

Ed Mathews

That's a good choice. But make sure you get your money's worth. I f- I find that if I shoot a 95 I feel better because I've s- you know, I got my money's worth in terms of the amount of number

Where to find Dan

Ed Mathews

of balls that I hit. Although in that case, these days 95 is a goal, not a reality. And I find myself in the woods and the water way more than I should be,

Dan Brisse

yeah, you gotta find that mentor, Ed,

Ed Mathews

you

Dan Brisse

know?

Ed Mathews

I, I don't for me I'm just looking to have, to turn it off and go have fun with my friends. I don't, it's I'm not winning any tournaments anytime soon. Although the shotguns and things like that, will, that, that amps up the adrenaline a bit. But and then so if folks want to learn more about you or Granite Tower Equity what's the best way to do that?

Dan Brisse

Yeah, you bet. So our website is www.granitetowersequitygroup.com, and there's a forward slash contact us or a contact us tab. Yeah, granitetowersequitygroup.com. Fill your information, and myself or someone on our team can hop on and see, get to know us, what we're doing. You can get in our database and see future deals. Nothing happens quick in our company. We might buy four apartments a year, might do four triple net lease deals. There's always another one coming. But at least you'll get some good education on what we're doing and how to create passive income and hedge inflation and ultimately get some depreciation in your life.

Ed Mathews

Awesome. That's a good thing. Dan, thank you so much for your time. It's a pleasure to meet you. And once again, congratulations on the amazing business that you've built.

Dan Brisse

Thanks for having me, Ed.

Ed Mathews

Cool. Hey, thank you very much

Dan Brisse

Yeah, you bet.

Ed Mathews

Congratulations, seriously, man

Head Shot

Ed Mathews

Host